The B2B Revenue Executive Experience
The B2B Revenue Executive Experience

Episode · 1 year ago

Why You’re Looking at Investments Wrong w/ Jonathan DeYoe

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

Financial planning has always seemed like voodoo to me.

 

Luckily, I have a podcast and can interrogate the experts.

 

Turns out, there are only 3 things you need to do for successful financial planning.

 

The trick is sticking to them.

 

But according to Jonathan DeYoe, Founder and CEO of Mindful Money and President of DeYoe Wealth Management, that’s easier said than done for most people. 

 

He joins me on the show today to discuss why so many people are so bad at financial planning and what we can do about it. 

 

Jonathan explains:

 

- What our culture gets wrong about financial planning

 

- The best way to approach investments

 

- Rethinking our definitions of success



This post includes highlights of our podcast interview with Jonathan DeYoe, Founder and CEO of Mindful Money and President of DeYoe Wealth Management..

 

For the entire interview, you can listen to The B2B Revenue Executive Experience. If you don’t use Apple Podcasts, we suggest this link.

Don't just buy the SB Ri hunder there'sa lot of risk. In that you know. Maybe you need some bonds. Maybe you needsome international, maybe need some other things in there and you want toset that ris level so that you can hold again when it's not comfortable to holdthe key is consistency, not brilliant you're. Listening to the DTB revenueexecutive experience, a podcast dedicated ELP EN executives train theirsales and marketing teams to optimize growth, whether you're looking fortechniques and strategies or tools and resources youv come to the right place.Let's accelerate your growth in three two one: welcome everyone to the Bto BRevenue Executive Experience: I'm your host Chad Sangerson today we're talkingsome about something. Many of US worry about struggle wit thor in some cases,maybe you're an avoid. It's called financial planning, and especiallyduring uncertain times when the world is influx. This can introduce a lot ofstress confusion often, but is something that we all should be payingattention to. So to help us. We have with this Jonathan Dio, founder ind, Coof mindful money and best selling author of mindful money. Simplepractices for reaching your financial goals and increasing your happiness,dividend Jonthan. Thank you, Fou're, taking a time and welcome to the show,thanks for have chat, happy to be here, so we always like to start with kind ofan offthe wall question just so, people get to know your a little bit betterand since we're all in the middle of this pandemic, that means we couldspend more time at home, and so I'm curious if the time at home has allowedyou to connect with or discover a hobby, AF passion or a pasttime, that's kindof giving you solace and all of this, so I honestly don't feel like I've hadany extra time Iran during the market dislocation like this. You know us inthe investment manageent world we've bee doing a lot to improve clens bottomlines and the same time, because there's been so much stress inhere, we've had uppor communication with clients and we've actually said:okay, let's take this time and launch to move themat, some new financialliteracy courses. That being said, I'm a big habit buff in my you know earlierthis year you know late December. Earlier January I was on a play and Iyou know, as often happens, you get off the plane. A D you get sick whatever'son the plane gets you so I got sick in my morning normal morning, routineswhich involve meditation. Some kind of high, intense ecercise reading, writinghad kind of fallen off, so I did use. I did use that early work from home toget back into the routine, and I'm now on my second round Pibx and quarantine yeah. I got to the point where I wasworking out with the resistance bands for the first thirty days, and I waslike okay. This is just not cutting it, so I ended up having n ended up puttingin a home gym just because I needed to be, I needed to be doing something morethan those resistance bands were allowing totally everyone. I've talkedto have said you know when you've asked the question what you been doing withyou' shelker in place so like I am exercising more yeah ye and it's greatand it's interesting because kind of...

...like we were talking before he record.I actually talked to the president in a fitness gallery here in Denver and hisbusiness is up three hundred and sixty eight percent this year. That's awesomegood for yeah yeah, which you know he s, and he was very grateful as gays. Wewere talking about before. So it's just it's interesting to see how it's allshaking out. So let's talk about financial planning and I'm going to bereally probably more honeste than I should be. This is black magic for me,like I'm good at a lot of things, but when it comes to financial planning orunderstanding, all of the Hi just makes my head hurt right, I'm creative bynature. It's always seemed like one of those disciplines for people that havemore money than I have. So how did you get into it and what was the path tolead? You founding your mindful money. So frankly, it's a good way to ask thequestion. I wasn't initially interested in financial planning. I was and ivealways been interested in investing. I purchased my first bock when I was nineyears old. I was at nine ten and eleven year old, an avid leader of the oldschool binders value line research. I dabbled with investing until graduateschool when I was hired by Dean Witter, which quickly morked in the MorganStanley and I was hired with them to sell investments. So I spent five yearslooking for a home at different Wall Street firms before starting my ownformin, two thousand and one and for me, financial planning came about as a wayto improve investing. The problem with investing in Ourculture, specifically,is that we are almost always market focused in performance priven, and thisis a problem because neither the market nor performance are ever in any waywithin our control. So if we're being honest as advisors, we can't predict orcontrol markets and the vast majority of people who attempt it fail. Sothere's got to be a better way, so the first stef of the better way is tounderstand the tradeoffs that we need to make in order to make the dreams ofour futureas become a reality and that's a that's, a real fancy way tosay: Pernantiral Plinng F, if we change from a market focus performance, Rimanattitude to a goal focused and planning driven attitude will begin to pull onlevers that might actually improve our long term outcomes. So I left WallStreet firms where I sold investments to specifically focus on those twinsupports of financial planning and education. Okay and so, and so we'vegot mindful money and mindful is IIT's almost becoming a buzz word. I mean, Iunderstand the science find it I'm a big believer in mindfulness, but I'mcurious is that shift in perspective, we're the application of that conceptof mindfulness comes as you apply it to financial planning for your clients,Yeah Yeah A, and I appreciate that we ask the question how you know: How dowe apply? I mind fom this tofor next Plann like what what is the link there?So they seem really different. To put it simply as you sort of surmise theplan becomes the signal in your...

...financial life. The financial media isthe noise. If we take for granted that markets are not predictable orcontrollable, then you got t ask the question why it does. Ninety fivepercent of nantial journalism focus on investment, selection and market timing.Remember those aren'tpredictable, so we need a tool to remember in the face ofwhatever the CATHC Catastra of the day. Is that allow us to focus on thatsignal? Which is our plan? Not The noe? Now, if you, if you have a planninplace, and even if that plan is comprehensive, both describing currentfuture sort of spending, saving trade offs and an investment processspecifically the minute, you turn on the radio or listen to a podcast orwatch TV or open a news reader, your bombarded with this noise, we got to keep in mind that behavioralpsychology tells us that we are riddled absolutely riddle with cognitive andemotional biases. That makes seeing the truth incredibly difficult in times ofstress, likecom, great recession, work, Covid, nineteen, so myfulness creates aspace for you to recognize the noise allow the noise to be present,investigate the noise in the context of your plan and then not react to it.MIFNOSS crazing doorway to ration flot. I like that. I like an I it. I meanit's very similar in any other place that you might apply mindfulness in Tomitself. I, like that concert of the space, gives you the space to thinkright instead of instead of given to the noise, and so based on that, yousaid something that was interesting. If we're in I mean we're in a pandemic, soeverybody's extremely stressed: There's heightened emotions across the boardeverybody's dealing with zoom fatigue and all of this stuff. Are therespecific actions you're suggesting that your clients take, because what Ithought I heard you say was focus on the signal, not the noise, so thatwould mean all of the Nos we're hearing today may not necessarily mean much tous. Depending on what our plan is. That's I mean you said it perfectly. Like that'sexactly right in this circumstance today, we're all locked at home,there's an enormous amount of noise, and we talked earlier about how lucky we are that this hasn'taffected our income. So I have to say that there are a lot of people. Youknow right in fir, there's a lot of people lost jobs. A lot of people arehaving a really difficult time with this. So while I do believe they willpull through this, it's a lot easier for someone like me, someone like youworking from home, where we can still be functional and still work. It's noteasier for us to be to manage our things and to payattention to the signal and not be overwhelmed by the noise, but yeah. Ofcourse, there's definitely advice. We offer in this kind of a time frame, andI put the advice in two different buckets. We remind people of the first bucket inthe first bucket is. This is the stuff we always do so in the allways bucket.It starts with accepting that bear...

...markets, regardless of the causes, arenormal, their unavoidable part of the process. It's because they'reunavoidable, unpredictable uncontrollable that we always. This isagain always bucket. Recommend people maintain the Emergency Fund and alwaysinvest with three basic principles. The first is plan appropriate, ascedelocation. The second is broad. Diversification in the third is regularrybalancing, and that sounds really simple, because it is really simple,but most people are incapable of following these simple three stepprocesses, then, because we are in the midst of a pandemic. There are a fewthings we're going to suggest that we do a little differently, but it'sreally just applying, or you K, ow tried and true to a new scenario, andso, when things break which they routinely do, we recommend adding arebalance when markets are dislocated what an opportunity to buy low and sellhigh and then sometimes when somethings go down in value, what a great chanceto tax loss farvest look for something you can use to set against future gains,and then you know maybe earlier in this pandemic and made a lot of sense, andwe may see markets fall again right now they recover quite nicely, but if theyfall again and you and you haven't thought about it, the last time maybeconsider a Rath conversion. If your income is down- and you can convert-you know from a traditional IRA to a Rafira- now might be a good time to dothat and then finally, the thing were recommending everybody do right. Now isrefinancing a homedebt, because I mean I literally yesterday I got a quotefrom my mortgage person saying that I could get a fifteen year fix mortgagefor under two and a half percent. That's Ye! THAT'S PRETTY MONEY! Wheninflation is at two to two point: One lite Ri. Would you not do that right right and so, when we think about money,it's a it's a stresser, especially in turbulent times right hen when peoplethat aren't as fortunate as the two of us are maybe struggling. So why is itthat this is? Is it? Is it really just about being able to provide for oneselfthat makes it such a stresser or is there cultural, environmental, otherelements that make it such a high stress conversation for so many people? So you know starting the same way. Westarted the last anter. The last question I think there I there are people thathave lost jobs where you know the stress comes from. How am I going topay my rent and that that's a different? That's a serious issue that againdoesn't face everybody. I think largely the concept of money is cultural. Theconcept of stress Rorm money is cultural, because we have we'vefinancialized everything. You know our idea of success is normally financial.The entire I have three seconds in my book. The entire Middle Sector of thebook is devoted to remembering what true wealth is so whote ofe thosethings that that bring us contentment and happiness things like stayinghealthy, continuous learning. You know...

...enew experiences, maintaining closerrelationships both with family and with friends, seeking purpose, somethingthat some way that you can give to the world staying accountable to yourselfbeing generous. Being grateful, so one of the important implications of theplanning process is you actually have to think about what matters to you.Your definition of success should involve things that make you happy andif you build a life on that foundation, moneys a low of stress- I love it. Ilove it all right. So let's say somebody walks in Yo. Well, maybe notwalks in your office right now, but gives you a call and they have they're like me, they'veno clue what they're doing, but we know we need to do something, and myexperience in the past, with financial planners or wealth managers is, thereis a very short window for me to build trust enough trust with them to believewhat they're telling me and also trust them with my money, and so I'm curious,the concept of mindfulness big fan of, but does it change the way you engagewith someone when they first walk in your office or first engaged withmindful money? What does that look like so that I mean the difference? Themindfulness difference that we present or that we that we believe in I've always had that Bot. I I 't know Idon't know how else I would do this, but when somebody does come into EurOffice fut that first time you know we're really asking a lot of questions.So we want to know what's important to folks what you valuvalue. What's your what's the financial history like? What are your moneyscripts? We really want to know if there is a philosophical fit betweenwhat we think we can offer and what somebody is looking for when recognizethe were a bit different and we want to make sure that we can help. But youknow we're more than happy in cases where somebody thinks that heytrading's right way to go- or you know, timing, Tho market, something they'reinterested in we're having to introduce another advisor and recommend otherpeople that have that believe that that's a possibility. I've got no issuereferring somebody else. The other part of this is we get a lot of calls frombooks who you know like the book or here hurt on one of these podcasts andreally like what we're saying, but who aren't ready for the types of you know:higher touch services and h things that we do so sometimes we end up referringthem to some basic one of our courses. We have. We have Fati litercy courses,we're actually working. You know in quarantine, working on a a sixteenmodule. You know soup to nut, finantial dersy course we're going to use it. Youknow in our community we're alse going to offer it to the world and sometimesloolk at them started with the course like that, and sometimes we'll say, heytry out some of our digital tools or a digital portfolios, arre a little bitless expensive, but also involved, less wit, that of a actural planer involved.I love it all right, so it do you do you think you know. I have a lot offriends B like Oh, no, no I'm to do it myself, I'm just going to open a etradeaccount or whatever, and I'm just going to trade stocks. That to me feels liketiming- and I am I getting this like I'm trying to time. The market is at acorrect, yeah, some sunny. So there I...

...mean those folks foll in I couplediferent categories. There are the people that are now on Robin Hood andtrying to you know I they're buying testlon and I think that's a problem,but there's also people that are saying you know I'm going to go to Bang Gardand O be broudly diverseified, an I'm just GNM gonna. Do I myself both ofthose people? You know. I worry about the person. That's Trading Min Tessla B,t the person that's being diversibied. If you can do those three behaviorsthat we talked about earlier, the the Plannen propiate Assen, Olocation, groddovespication. Rebalancing people would do that on their own and if they can dotheir own great, if they want some support in that process or supportingthe planning process. That's why we created the courses like we created thecourses to educate people about you, know it. Let's it. Let's, let's facethe mean the reality is the financial life is way bigger than investinginvesting is a piece of it. There's a right way to do that. I believe,there's all this other stuff. You know your state plan, your you know what oyou ow, how you leav your kids, you know when you're nout there with youensure stuff you're, not intue stuff. You know spending versus saving. Howmuch do we have to say diat the pointad point Pol oint s. You know whate of theall these different pieces, a e are important to work together, and so Ithink people can employ those three behaviors themselves. I think that thechallenge becomes when you're employing those behaviors yourself and then covidhappens. You know, can you stick with it when it's not comfortable, and thatis. That is why you know when I first got healthy. When I went to the gym forthe first few times, I had a had a coach that tell me you know I know isthis is painful, but you got to push out two more raps or I realize Y Irealize this is this is not easy to do, but we got to run another two miles andtomorrow we're going to run three more. You know so it's it's part of thatcoaching process is supporting the right behaviors precisely when it's themost difficult time to employ them. Okay, love it, and so when you talkabout Gol, focused and plan appropriate investing, can you go a little bitdeeper on that because it sounds great, but I'm not a hundred percent sure I'vegot my head rapped roun it which I'm Gonao assume means the audienceprobably hasn't either yeah. But I mean it's really simple. So by being goalfocuse, what I'm saying is understand where you want to go at the beginningand then create a plan that involves not just investment returns but savingenough to get alongside those investment returns. And then you builda portfolio with the types of wrisk levels that would be appropriate tothat plan. So planappropriate is simply meaning you know, don't just buy the SD Rithunder there's a lot of risk. In that you know. Maybe you need some bonds.Maybe you need some international, maybe need some other things in thereand you want to set that ris level so that you can hold again when it's notcomfortable to hold the key is consistency, not brilliant Aai love itthat Aur marketing teams going to pull that out. As one of your quote just youknow, I can already tell. I know that one, and so so, is that one of the topmistakes you see individuals make because they don't keep that consistentbehavior with those three Babiers as...

...they go and do it themselves. Is thatto the number one challenge you see ors tor a different one. I think the numberone challenges people never actually Stopp to think about what of therbehaviors thay're supposed to employ, but yeah once they know those behaviors.Then they go into the world and the world just trows them stuff all thetime and they have to react and they become reactionary and if you becomereactionary, you're, never acting on the plan and if you know GreatInvestors Act on their plan. The investors that often fail are reactingto some sort of market stimulus. All the time and you just you again, youcan't time markets and that's the that's the biggest illusion that thefinancial press as given us is that you know Su Covit happens. Then I should dosomething well well, whencom happened. I should do something wellwt. Were youdoing to begin with right, like Shit Yur it out and then do it that way anddon't change, because somebody changes the immediate present because it, youknow how many of these things have happened,and then they just go away in time. Right in this. You know it's difficultfor people to hear it, but I've said this now, a thousand times covid ispainful. Is tnot going to be a lot of people that die I'll whole bunch, moretheyre and get sick, but this to show CASS and markets and economies aregoing to kick off where they, where they ended and much is going to returnto the way it was excellent, all right. So, let's ChangeDirection here, a little bit. We ask all of our guess kind of two standardquestions at the end of each interview. First, as simply as the COAN founder,that makes you a target or prospect for a lot of other people out there sellingstuff, and so I'm always curious to know. If somebody doesn't have atrusted referral into you, they don't know somebody who you trust to get intothe door. What is it that works with you to capture your attention and peek?Your curiosity, so somebody can earn time on your calendar Wow. That's that's almost not possible. I mean seriou seriously so ther's onlyas you know, there's we all I do specifically, but I'm sure that mostfounders of companies do this. We Build Barrier Saxons. The only thing Iactually check myself is my link then, and the vast majority of people rtrying to connect on Lincoln. I actualely conect with them, but then,if I get that email from them right afterwards, it says hey, you know. Wethink we have this new product that you should buy, I'm going to basicallydelete that connection immediately right. The trick, I think, is to makeit personal, like how many I know you probably get this to like how many, howmany link in requests or emails do you get whether just they haven't donetheir homelorke Iya people thatare offer me jobs, I'm like I have nointerest in working for someybody else at all, so Havn't don their homework.Eeveen looked at who I was what I'm interested in what I'm passionate about,but sometimes like I had I now high school student from Berthley Californiahit's, where I wen my offices who emailed me, and it was intriguingbecause he actually asked the question. You know how does mindfulness fit intopersonal finence and investing Ti'm really curious, and that was it. He wascurious about what I was gassing about:...

AU Kniw, like I'm, going to talk tothis kid right: Right: R, we've, connacted and nowhe's, actually in ourin one of our education systems, but yeah. If you make it personal and youknow what I stand for then much more likely to get through still that's anup ill battle for sure all right. Last question: We Calle itour acceleration insight. There was one thing you could tell: Sales Marketing,professional service people, just professional people in general. Onepiece of advice you could give them that you believe would help them hittheir targets. What would it be? And why just one just why yeah one all right? So that's the the thing thathelps him peop their target, I think is. Is You got to keep score on the behaviorsthey're going to move the needle for you? So maybe it's you know. Maybe it'sfirst time contaxts. Maybe it's linked in connections. Maybe it's gettingproposals into the hands of great prospects. You know: Choose the poor orflive things that move the move, the needle and then and thentrack thosethings, and by the way when, when I did this for myself, I made daily exerciseone of the things that moves the needle, because I think that I think that thedifficulty of committing to a daily exercise program- and you know the pain,your experience in doing highantens- I thei hiintens obe trained kinds ofthings pushing through that creates a muscle exercises, not just your muscles,but the habit. Muscle the discipline, muscle and sales, as you know, is oftenjust repetit. You do this thing a number oftimes and certain number people are going to say yes, and so I think youshould get points for committing to health and I'm going to sneak one enleave a profit. This is my second one and leave a profit in every interactionwith every potential client make sure you're giving more than you'reexpecting yeah that I love that big fan of that one myself, as well as theexercise. So all right. So John. If a listeners interested in learning moreabout the topics wove touched on where's the best place to send them tothe website, yeah bet supposed to go, be mindful dot money and if, if theysign up for for our email list, make sure theyr reference either your nameor e or the name of the podcast, and we will send them. You know announcementswhen we're launching courses and those kinds of things will send them invitesto our to some of the precourses we put out excellent John. I can't thank youenough for taking time it's been great. Having you on the show chat has beengreat. I appreciate it all right, everybody that does t with this episode.You know the drill be to be revizeccom share with friends, family coworkers.If you like what you hear, leave us your eview on itunes. Until next time,we at Valu selling associates wishing nothing but the greatest success. You've been listening to the BTBrevenue executive experience to ensure that you never miss an episodesubscribe to the show in Itunes or your favorite podcast player. Thank you somuch for listening until next time.

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