The B2B Revenue Executive Experience
The B2B Revenue Executive Experience

Episode · 3 years ago

Sales Secrets to Close Quickly w/ Chris Orlob

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

You’re not as unique as you think you are, and Chris Orlob, senior director of product marketing for Gong.io, increased sales through science, can prove it.

Sales is both an art and a science, and Orlob visited my podcast recently with the data at his fingertips to solve all of your sales problems.

Closing techniques are dead. That's how it starts. It doesn't necessarily say closing. Is that, though? What it means is that, like the slick lions that you think are going to be your magic bullet, probably are not going to work. You're listening to the B Tob Revenue Executive Experience, a podcast dedicated to helping executives train their sales and marketing teams to optimize growth. Whether you're looking for techniques and strategies, were tools and resources, you've come to the right place. Let's accelerate your growth in three, two, one. Welcome everyone of the B Tob Revenue Executive Experience. I'm your host, Chad Sanderson. Today we are lucky to have with US Chris ORLA, of Senior Director Product Marketing from Gong Dio, and anybody that has spent any amount of time with me knows that I reference the research that Gong labs does all the time. Their insights are amazing. They're from the organizational level down to what reps can be doing, and awareness is awareness is half the battle. So if we're not aware of what we should be doing, we can't make the changes necessary. So I'm extremely excited for this conversation and Chris, I'm going to welcome to the show. Thank you for taking the time. Long Overdo. Thanks chat. We have been trying to schedule US for several months, so I am extremely excited that we're finally getting it done. Yeah, this is going to be fun. I'm looking forward to it. So we always start to show with one odd off ball question just so people get a better sense for kind of you as a person, and let's start with you know, a hobby that you may have the individuals that know you from a professional standpoint maybe a little bit surprised to know you're passionate about. Yeah, so I'm a hardcore metal drummer, like the kind where they like scream. You know, that was actually my first career aspiration. So in high school I literally spent my high school days just drumming all the time on the double pedal. And, funny enough, just yesterday I spent four hours jamming with my CEO and VP of marketing because we're doing a super secret video shoot which involves US covering a song I can't I can't tell you what it's about, but about it soon enough. So, Yep, hardcore metal drummer. I don't look the part at all. I used to. I had like the pierced ears, long hair, all that kind of stuff. Not so much anymore, though. Two kids will change you. Oh yeah, it calms you down real fast. So when we say hardcore metal, like there's different genres out there, and as a metal head myself, I have to ask give me a couple of bands that help us August Burns read a data remember. It's kind of like more modern metal stuff, not so much like the S, like hair metal, nothing like that. When you say hardcore, I think like Cannibal Corps. No, no, that's too intense for me. No, because nothing like demonic or murder or anything like that. But Um, I guess like so not to get like religious, and I'm not really religious myself, but Christian metal is when I really enjoy okay, all just like the song, really good, anything with a double bass in it.

I also play a lot of punk, though, like link one hundred and eighty two. You know, that kind of stuff was the stuff I drummed to growing up, so still love it. Excellent. Yeah, so for anybody that's my Chris, I know that's going to be a shock and I bout fell over when I heard that. So thank you very much. Thank you very much for sharing that. So of course, all right. So let's get into the topic at hand. So let's talk data, statistics and insights again. Guys, if you haven't checked out going labs, highly recommend you do. Chris is prolific in the research that he puts out there and those insight should be something that I think every sales organization and individual should be checking out on a regular basis. But you guys came out with something interesting around top performing companies versus lower performing company so kind of run us through that a little bit. Yeah, there's going to be a lot of details that I can't cover in an interview, so I encourage everybody who's interested to kind of flesh out what I'm about to say to go check out the article. You can find out on my linkedin profile. But the majority of the research we do here at Gong is comparing reps versus reps to see what's working in sales, like a top performing rep versus, you know, average performing Reps. but this particular research study was a top performing sales organization or organizations versus average performing sales organization. So we were comparing organizations versus each other or to figure out what separated the world's best sales teams from average ones. And, in short, just in one word, what we found is top performing sales teams are consistent from rep to Rep. they're consistent in the messages and stories that they go to market with, how their reps approach their call structures, like how much time is spent on discovery versus demoing, etc. And all of their selling motions. They are in lock step. All of the reps and those types of sales teams are marching in the same direction, following the same process. But when you step inside a poor performing sales team, or even an average performing sales team, there is a large amount of inconsistency from rep to Rep. they are telling different stories, they're telling different messages, they're asking different questions and they're following totally different processes. In fact, if you step on one side of a poor performing sales team and then you walk over to the other side of that same team, say there's like hundreds of reps, it will sound like they are totally different companies. They're doing such different things. So, to just kind of sum up what we learned in that study is the world's best sales teams. They're not scripted by any means, but they are following the same playbook, selling motions, call structures, messaging, etc. So there's there's a process component into that, right, you can, you can articulate, you know, here is our organizations sales process, here's how the playbook unfolds, these are the motions and plays you need to go through it any given time. But then there's also a behavior component to that, I would assume as well, right, for consistent...

...behavior. So it's like here's what I do at each stage and for how long or whatever these details may be, but then here's how I do it. and Are you seeing we you know, when you guys did any of that or based on any of the research, have you seen a difference between the processes? The organization lays it out to drive consistency. Then the behaviors at the reps execute themselves. Let's say. Yeah, it's kind of like a micro process within the grand sales process. So like at the macro level, of course, you know they're all following the same methodology, the sale, the same sales process from from first contact to close. But there's a lot of quote unquote, microprocesses or, as you said, behaviors that occur within that greater process, which is what questions do we ask during our discovery call, or how do we flow through our demo for this buyer persona, or what's our playbook for following up on our first introductory sales meeting to ensure the next meeting the scheduled and goes well? So, yeah, consistency, both at the broad sales process level as well as the behaviors that make that process move forward to begin with. And so when managers have you, I' mean you've probably seen this yourself, but in order to get me the process to find consistently across the organization is one step and that takes a coup, of course, a group of people to agree that this is what we're going to do from a behavioral standpoint. Have you seen managers or is done any data researcher had any experience around managers and their effectiveness at coaching to the process and those microprocesses of behaviors having an impact? Yeah, part of it is coaching, but part of it is just defining what good looks like and showing reps the way and then coaching against what good looks like and how they've defined it, because what a lot of sales organizations do is kind of this old school wild west thing where, you know, I imagine like an insurance sales organization and like the s or something, where they just like hire people and throw them into the water and expect them to like it quota and everybody's kind of out beating the streets doing their own thing. Well, a modern sales organization, and again I want to be cleared that they do not script things. It's more about putting what do they call those things in a bowling alley, like the bumpers on the sides, right, more about putting the bumpers and giving reps freedom to weave, you know, to move within the bumpers. But yeah, modern sales organizations define what good looks like from first contact to close so that when they hire somebody, instead of just pushing them into freezing cold water, they have directionally a playbook that's going to help them take leads and opportunities from first contact to close. Of course there's going to be a ton of nw once that every rep needs to figure out for himself or herself that, you know, lie between that. Not Everything can be documented or you're going to have this unwieldy three hundred page manual that nobody reads.

But as far as defining, you know, the bumpers for the bowling alley, that's totally doable by any sales organization without a doubt, and being able to define that. I like that analogy with the bumpers right, because it allows for the authenticity of the sales rep to come through, because we don't want cookie cutter Sales Reps. we want consistent behavior, we want consistent usage of the process, but we're still people, right, we still want to connect with the individuals and I've seen some organizations it gets so tight on. Here's the script you will use at this point that it doesn't matter if I'm talking to you know, Larry or Linda. They all sound exactly the same and that gives that raises a flag for me as a buyer. Yeah, giving, giving everybody a word for word script will give you perfect consistency but will kill all authenticity and the net effect is to decrease close rates and success rates. But but when you give I need to find a good word for this. But what does it bumper? I keep forgetting what a side numbers, whatever they're, that's a guide, I mean it's it's a context within which they can operate. Perhaps. Yeah, when you when you give those bumpers, you give enough consistency and enough authenticity to dramatically increase your success rates. So you might be sacrificing a tiny bit of consistency by foregoing the script, but the authenticity more than makes up for it. Gotcha excellent. And so when we get down into the you know, we talked to organizationally about consistency. So that's you know, it's process and microprocessor behaviors. But you guys do a lot of research around, you know, top reps and underperforming reps, and there was a pieceach guys. I think there's November of last year, around list price, pricing, words like I think it's the simple word will turn your deal, I want to say, is into a nightmare. So help me understand from a pricing standpoint, reps, this is where reps often end up, where they don't you know, they're not comfortable negotiating or they're not comfortable really selling them on true value from the bierus perspective versus. Hey, here's our list price and I can give you ten percent off. help us understand what you found there. Yeah, so we analyzed, I think at that time it was about three million sales conversations and we've looked at this analysis a lot of different ways. That goes beyond just you know what we're about to talk about here. And if I'm remembering correctly, you know you can read the full article on Gong got Io blog. But if I'm remembering correctly, when a rep utters the word lists, play, list price, about the customer, but the rep, it dramatically prolongs the sales cycle. And that's because when you say the word list price, you are effectively subcommunicating to your buyer that the price is negotiable and they're going to do everything they can to squeeze every drop of value they can out of this deal. So you've just kind of given your buyer permission and negotiate with you. So on the flip side, top performing reps, you'll never hear them use...

...the word list price unless they're using it in some sort of like weird strategic way where it's like, you know, I can take this amount off of list price if you guys are willing to sign this month. That's a bad example, but they might be willing to use it sometimes. But what top performers typically do is they'll say things like approved pricing, which sounds immovable, or they just won't even say those words at all. They'll say the investment or they'll use priced anchoring tactics that get your total pricing to seem smaller by comparing it to a bigger number. So here's an example. We do this a gong all the time. Like say we're selling a fiftyzero deal to a customer whose own deal size is seventy five thou dollars. They'll ask what's your pricing and will respond with what's your average deal size, and they'll say seventy five tho dollars or a hundred thousand dollars. And then we'll make some conversation and say pricing is Fiftyzero and now, just because we've started with a higher number, not even a price, but they just have this higher number in their mind which is their own average deal size of k. We deliver the pricing which is K and it sounds significantly more digestible just because we've thrown out some higher number that's not even related to it. It just helps them digest that number and it makes it seem smaller. Well, raises the bar. It raises it raises a cap in their head. Whether it's artificial or not. You took them from looking this now, okay, I want it to be this big. That will hey, we're you know, we're selling seventy FIVEZERO deals. So if ours is smaller, you've already set that Bar, the number that they just went through their brain higher. It's a beautiful tactic and, if I remember, I said just pulled it up so I can say your research shows that if you say the words a list price, guys, listen audience really closely here, because I get calls all this all the time on us. How do I make my sales cycle shorter? If you're if you say the words a list price, it literally adds nineteen percent to the length of your sales process. So in sixty days that's an extra twelve days tacked on. Now for you guys are doing enterprise deals, that gets even bigger and Harrier. Well, and you got to think about why that is, because when you say the word lists price, most people would think they would intuitively understand how that can decrease your deal size because people are asking for discounts and I'm more likely to negotiate with you. So why would that increase your sales cycle? And the reason is the word list price introduces uncertainty into your buyers mind about whether or not they've arrived at the best deal possible, and so they're going to negotiate with you and they're going to delay and delay until they are absolutely shut you've given them the best price. As soon as you communicate list price to them, they're not really sure whether the proposal you've given them is the absolute best price that you can give them, because you've communicated that your price is negotiable. So instead of just, you know, whittling down a little bit off of your list price and then accepting it...

...and closing the deal, they're going to keep asking for more discounts and they're going to delay and kind of twiddle their thumbs, thinking, I wonder if I can get an even better deal. So you're creating a massive emotional hurdle in your buyers psychology when you say the word list price at any point. Excellent. Okay, so let's talk about because I've done some amazing research around selling to sea level exacts. Now this is going back in the middle of last year and you guys, we're talking about number of questions. For those that are looking for it. It's the sobering truth why you can't sell the sea sweet executives. Is The blog post specifically referring to. But interesting when I read that the first time. You know, we always hear ask a lot of questions. Ask a lot of questions, but in that research you guys found that there's actually a negative correlation depending on the level of person you're selling to an organization, which, from my perspective, requires self awareness from the Rep understand what level are at and what discovery means to the different individuals in the organization. But I'm curious when you you know, because it's all about we want to get them to talk more. But at some point we have to start asking value, right value, providing value, because it's not we're waste in time at some point, and so I'd love to hear kind of your perspective on, you know, what's the right level of questions depending on where you are in the sales process. And then what have you seen? When you start selling to the c sweet it's so much less about asking more questions and so much more about asking the right questions, which seems like a simple thing to execute, but it really isn't. So, just to tee up the research, what we found is that in a quote unquote average discovery call without a C sweet executive being there, between eleven and fourteen questions as kind of the sweet spot that helps you gather the most amount of information. It correlates with the highest close rates etc. But when sellers, or typical sellers, enter into a meeting selling to a sea sweet executive, there is a dramatic decrease in close rates when you ask more than four questions. Now that can be interpreted in a lot of different ways, but what is most likely happening. Happening is the average seller naively hops into this meeting and starts asking generic, run of the mill discovery questions to the point where the sea sweet either polite lead bows out of the meeting or, more rudely, kicks them in the teeth. And so what happened to me and the story the guy was like he's straight up said I don't have time for this generic line of questioning and he just walked out of the room. So I'm not necessarily saying do not ask questions to see sweet executives, but if you're, if you benefit from the question you're about to ask and the sea sweet executive doesn't, then you should not ask them that question. If you are asking them to transfer information to you so that you can sell them to them or sell to them better, you're doing it wrong. If you're asking a question that makes them think differently or somehow provides value. Now that's a question you...

...can lead with when you're having a meeting with a sea sweet executive. Well, that's part of the that's part of the how do you, how do you effectively and consistently work with or sell to see sweet without creating friction? Right, we want to be providing value and insight throughout the process. That requires not going in and you know, we used to call it show up and throw up, but like there's a level of preparation and self awareness that goes into this that I'm not I don't know, maybe I'm just not seeing enough reps to do it, because we live in this ultra fast paced and world these days and you know there's cal videos on facebook that have to be seen so to cut time time constraints. So you know, when you're working with teams, are you're selling yourself? How much is that on? got a curiosity. How much time do you put into prepping those questions, or do you guys have a repository of questions that you go to that you know have been, you know, architected for success? So we do have a, you know, a repository. We call it our go to market map here, because we've identified like a predictable set of six to eight business problems we solve and those conversations for each business problem tend to unfold in a fairly predictable manner. However, we do a significant amount of pre call research here at Gung, especially when we're selling up market or to high level executives like svps and C sweet and so I've always been confused because, you know, I'm in marketing now, I'm in product marketing now, but most of my career has been in sales. I like, at a gut level, I could not get onto a sales meeting without preparing. I would feel like something is horribly wrong and I would probably be like shaking a little bit. I just wouldn't like know to do my with myself and I see reps are doing that all the time and it drives me crazy one just because I know it's ineffective and too because I'm like probably a little jealous, like how are you to in this? And that's not to say, like I said, script my entire conversations, but I want to know everything I can going in because I' know I've got one shot to compel that person or persuade that person and if I don't do it in this one meeting, I'm not going to get my second chance. Well, I mean it goes back to that bumper analogy that we were using earlier, right, you want, you want to do the research to know. You know, and I'm going a little deep with it, but you know what. What material are the pins made out of? What are the balls made out of? It? Has the floor been waxed recently? So I know how to you know, throw the throw the ball, guide the ball down the lane within the context that we know is successful. If you go in and just wing it, it creates a horrible situation for all involved. I've had a sales rep, actually this is happened last week, and a sales rep call me and I've never met the guy, but I gave him, I think, ten minutes of my time because I, you know his I don't know its prospecting email or something kind of caught my fancy. And he starts out with telling me a story about how he had just come back from the shore from his buddies wedding, and I'm sitting here going what, like, I gave you ten minutes, why are you wasting this time? And it doesn't take a lot of research on me,...

...because I have a tendency to, let's say, live wide open. So it's done take a lot of research. Realize that you're talking to a guy who's been through two divorces. So do you really want to talk to me about weddings? Like, is that really what you want to be doing for ten minutes, let alone what I'm focused on is a businessperson, and so you could tell it was one of those show up and and throw up wing it kind of scenaris. Oh, I'm good enough at what I do, I'm going to be able to get somebody across finish line. But today, man, you have limited amount of time to make the impact. If you don't do the prep up front, you just setting yourself up for failure. Well, I think it also goes to show how much, probably incorrect in tuition, goes into sales theory and sales execution. Because, like, that's one of the things we aim to do with our research is bring data to what actually works and sales. And I am willing to bet you that this gentleman who you have this meeting with thought that he was doing the right thing. He probably showed up to this meeting intentionally trying to, quote unquote, build rapport right by telling this story. And that's the entire problem with the sales profession is we have like these mental movies in our minds about what we think will work, and it's just based off some sales book we read or maybe just our intuition, whereas, like, you know, what we're trying to do just with Gong Lab, specifically, not going in the entire COMP company, but just this, you know, kind of project we have going at Goong is bring some level of data. Like if that guy had been armed with, you know, some sort of research study that said in ex situation, leading with rapport building tactics actually causes failure, then he wouldn't have done that, I would bet. Yeah, I would hope so. I mean I corrected him very nice. Well, I corrected him. I don't know if it was nice. I hope him understand to get the call back on track because I was interested in what they had and and honestly, if it had if it hadn't been me, chances are somebody like me what he is like, yeah, I don't have time for this, hung up and there was you just lost it. Somebody who was interested, knew your product, knew what it could do. Really didn't have to do much selling other than it's a couple questions, but you come in with it. It's the wrong, wrong approach, using this this gut like I don't know you yet, like don't go so familiar with me yet. We're not. They're right. We're not ready to do that. Yeah, and personally I'm not a guy with who really enjoys small talk that much. I I'm sure, like rapport building at the outset works on some people. I am not one of those people, though, like I very much want to get to the point when it comes to sales interactions. Yeah, I mean the small talk. It's funny because I remember back in the day, I remember when phones had chords. I remember back in the day you used to really focus on the how do I build apport hey, let's go grab launch or let's get some coffee and let's talk. And then now there's been this switch and because everybody's time is so limited, you actually show more respect and gain more credibility versus before by getting to the point and respecting that time. Then that shows that you're interested in them if you're asking the right questions, and it naturally...

...become naturally moves into kind of that small talk area where it feels not so forced. But a lot of sales organizations aren't structured or people aren't structured in that way to execute that way. Do the PREP, show you're worth the time. Then you have the opportunity, you've purchased your ticket to potentially have a different level of relationship with that individual. Yeah, it communicates competence. Like if you show up to a meeting, maybe make two minutes of small talk just to kind of like, you know, soften the edges, just basic greetings, and then you immediately go into like setting an agenda at the purpose getting your buyers FY in and on on that, they'll sit up straight and in their mind. They're kind of like, Oh shit, like this guy's serious and this is going to be a valuable use of my time. Right, excellent, so let's there's one other piece of data that you guys have put out their research. You're done. I want to touch on before we move towards the end of this and that's on the closing there's a lot of closing techniques out the there. Everybody you know. There seems to be a new one every day that comes up, which actually is funny when you look at them. Actually just a rehash or something old. But you guys did a report about closing techniques being dead right and I think's just from me. If you everybody out there is looking for it, it's May twenty four of two thousand and eighteen was the was the blog post. Would love to jump into this and it's great. On Your Book Post You actually have the Alec Baldwin ABC always be closing, which basically says it all to anybody who's paying attention to what's going on in sales today. But would love to jump into this a lot because I get a lot of calls on Hey, my people need to close. I need help get him to close. And I've got a patent answer for that, but would love to hear kind of what you guys uncovered. So I think you need to look at the specific words of that title of that blog post, which it says closing techniques are dead. That's how it starts. It doesn't necessarily say closing is that, though. What it means is that, like the slick lines that you think are going to be your magic bullet, probably are not going to work. And what we found is we analyzed, just as we're known for, all of these sales conversations and all of these sales deals and we could always find huge differences between calls that happened early in the sales process that ended up winning, versus calls that happened early in the sales process that ended up losing. In other words, things that happen early on tend to create totally different paths for a deal. A discovery call that leads to a close to deal is a lot different looking than a discovery call that leads to a lost or a one deal. But when we looked at closing calls, like the final call or few calls in a sales process, between both one deals and lost deals, we could find literally no difference between them, not they looked the exact same. And so what that tells us is the trajectory of your sales process is set during the first half. It's kind of like trying to change the TRADEC trajectory of a meteor that's barreling toward earth. So if it's at like the...

...beginning of its path and you change the trajectory by one percent to the right, that meteor is probably on a Miss Earth. But if it's already pierced Earth's atmosphere and it's toward the end of its quote unquote process and you change its trajectory by even thirty percent or forty percent, it's still going to hit earth. It's too late. It's already been on the same trajectory for too long. So that's kind of a way of saying like, whatever slick line you just learned on the Internet is not going to save your deal if you didn't do the right things at the beginning of the sales process. But I will say this, it's the slick techniques that are not going to work. The act of closing still needs to happen, but it's so overanalyzed. The act of closing is just an active leadership. It is being the decisive one in the scenario because you can almost skin there guarantee that your buyer is facing a situation of uncertainty and indecision. It's it is just acting decisively, recommending the solution and that your buyer move forward with it, and just communicating leadership. It's being a leader. Selling is an active leadership, agreed, one hundred percent, and if you're focused on the wrong things, just that from the beginning, you're not going to get where you want to be at the end of it. I always reply and say, you know, look, closing is a natural step in a well executed plan to get someone to realize the value you just sold them on. And we have a tendency to see reps focus on I got to get the contract sign when, if you're really selling on true value from that buyers perspective, you really want to be talking about focusing on the day. When do you want to see the results? If you want to see the results, at this end of this quarter, we've it's got to be live for ninety days in order to get it live and like back into that, and then one of those steps is going to be signing a contract. Whole bunch of ways to do negotiation, but if you do, if you're only focused on that contract and you ask the wrong questions the beginning, it's going to make it twice as hard, if not greater, in order to get the deal actually done. Yeah, yeah, I would say closing is not a technique. It's more of a virtue. It's like like that. It's like trust, like the worst thing you could ever ask is like what's a good trust building technique? You don't build trust with the technique. You build trust as a result of being trustworthy. It's like a result of who you are and as a byproduct of being a trust for their trustworthy person, you build trust. Closing is the same way. I can't give you a specific, specific set of words at the end of your sales process that's going to make somebody sign a contract. But if you're an experienced leader, or not even experience, just if you have the ability to be a leader, you're going to sense what your buyer needs in that situation to move forward. Perfect all right. So, just for context sake, because of a lot of research that gets done out there with small data sets and every time I look at her is, it's like millions of records. Are Hundred half a million records analyze. Just so our audience understands and...

...basically for me to can you help us understand kind of the size of the data set that you guys are doing this analysis against, because I think it's important for people understand this isn't a one off based on some small random data set. Yeah, so the is size of our data set is growing exponentially. I think right now it's at about three point five million recorded sales conversations that we gather anonymously from our customer base who use our software which records, transcribes and analyzes these sales conversations. Not every single piece of research is based on all three and a half million of those. will take segments of them. Some of them have been, you know, like sixty thou demo calls, some of them have been a little over a hundred thousand cold calls, but the the entire database at the time of this recording is about three point five million total recorded sales conversations. By the time people listen to this it might be even bigger because it's based on our customer base and frankly, we're growing extremely fast. Excellent. All right. So we got we asked to standard questions towards the end of every interview. The first is, if somebody doesn't know you and they don't have a referral into you, like I did, how does somebody reach out to you if they want to have a conversation around maybe a problem that you have that they want to solve, or some you know, get some of your time? What have you found to be the most effective approaches personally for someone to capture your attention, build the credibility for you to give them fifteen minutes to your time? So I can't recommend this for everybody. I can tell you what would work on me, but it might not be repeatable. Who knows? But I like when peep, when people help me exploit an opportunity rather than solve a problem them, and there's a difference between those. If I'm just trying to solve a problem, there's a value in that, but all I've done when I've solved the problem is I've brought things back up to normality. You know, I've brought things back up to the status quo. If you can tell me, like there's some opportunity that you can go exploit, and here it is and here's how it's relevant to you, your business and your role in your priorities. Now I'm more interested because it helps me leap frog from where I am and where my business is to where I want it to be. Its progress that helps me move forward. Excellent. All right. If there was one piece of ice, we called our acceleration inside, one piece of advice you could give to sales professionals out there that you believe, if they internalized, would help them crush their numbers and achieve their goals, what would it be and why? I'll get a lot of people who probably disagree with me on this, but I would say read for an hour every day at five or six am. Do that for seven years and you will wake up to a completely different life, and not just because you've accumulated knowledge, but I mean that's the big part. But reading and exposing yourself to all of those words makes you a better communicator. Like your essentially stealing thoughts from some of the smartest people in the world and those thoughts end up making their way out of your mouth at some point in some just everyday situation. I like to think I'm,...

...at least most of the time, a fairly well spoken guy, and that's just because I read a lot. Like I absorb more words and sentences and paragraphs than most people do, and so reading makes you not only more knowledgeable, but it just makes you a better communicator, which is our job as sales professionals. Love it. That is, I'll be honest, as a first time I've heard that one, and that's probably one of my favorites as a English Major Undergrad and have a reason myself. So take that excellent Chris. So, if somebody wants to get in touch of your best way to hit you guys up, hit the website, hitch on Linkedin. What's what would you prefer? Yeah, we've talked a lot about research. We come out with a new piece of research usually every three weeks or so. So you can stay up today on the fresh at freshest research that has some insanely useful sales toast by going to Gongda IO blogged, that's geomng do io blog and subscribe, put your email address and will send you the fresh stuff. Excellent. All Right, I cannot thank you enough for taking the time to be on the show. It's been an absolute pleasure to have you. Yeah, it was fun. Thanks Chad. All right, everybody, that's it. You know the drill. CHECK US OUT WILL BE TO BE REV exactcom share with your friends, Families Co workers. Hit US up on Itunes, drop us a review and until next time, we advance selling associates, wishing nothing but the greatest success. You've been listening to the BB revenue executive experience. To ensure that you never miss an episode, subscribe to the show and Itunes or your favorite podcast player. Thank you so much for listening. Until next time,.

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