The B2B Revenue Executive Experience
The B2B Revenue Executive Experience

Episode · 3 years ago

James Carbary on the Fastest Way to Establishing B2B Relationships using Content Based Networking


Everyone agrees that relationships are incredibly important in business. But nobody is talking about how to consistently create those relationships, strategically… Well, all except for one:

James Carbary, the Founder and CEO of Sweet Fish Media, explained if ‘Content is King, then Content Based Networking is the Kingdom’. Content Based Networking is the term that he and his team created in order to describe the unique vertical they’re in. James defines it like this: “Using content collaboration as a way to build new business relationships.”

Create some sort of Content Hub (James chose Podcasting). Then invite people that you’d like to build relationships with, to create that content with you. “It’s not what you know; it’s who you know;” and Content Based Networking is the ‘how-to’ that you need in order to do it.

I just don't see a lot of peopletelling folks how to actually create relationships with people. All they sayis the importance of relationships, and you got to have relationships with likehy. How do you do that? Oh, this is actually a really simple way to do it. You're listening to the BTB revenueexecutive experience, a podcast dedicated ELP, an executives train,their sales and marketing teams to optimize growth, whether you're lookingfor techniques and strategies were tools and resources. You've come to theright place. Let's accelerate your growth in three to one: welcomeeveryone to the B to be revenue executive experience. I'm your hostChat Sanderson. Today we're going to be talking about content based networkingand to help us do it. We have the man the myth, the legend, Mr James Carberry,foundher, sweetfish, weda James. Thank you so much for being on the show,thanks for having me man, I'm really excited Ot Cha wit, dtoday yeah. It'sfull circle for all these people out there who aren't aware of it, but Jameswas the one that got me into podcasting and helped us set up. This showoriginally and sweetfish if Hee's, this shameless plug sweetfish amazing, sohighly recommend you guys reach out and work with them. But let's talk contentbased nowworking, how about a start with the definition yeah man so so. Theway we define content base networking is using content collaboration as a wayto build new business relationships. I mean you've been in the game, longenough to know that I don't think anybody would argue with saying thatrelationships are incredibly important in business and it's not what you knowa to. You know. We've all heard that saying a million times, but I don't seea lot of people telling people how to actually create those relationships.It's based on a lot of hope and Seran depity, like I hope this person's at an event thatI'm going to or at this local chamber of Commerce meet up that I'm about toattend, or I just hope that I meet the right people and we feel like we reallyfigured out a way to reverse engineer the right kind of relationships, and wedo it on the back of podcasts and other types of media that you can create withyour ideal customer so yeah, that's the long and short of it. So when you lookat that stuff and you get strategic about it, so when you want a network, Isaid you want to target somebody. That's going to be t that ChamberofCommerce, O that or you know at that next meetup. What kinds of things areyou seeing or advising clients to do to leverage the content they've created?If you know someone in your community, you want to connect with him they'renot responding to your emailsthey're, not at the Chamber of Commerce Meetingfor you to meet Sarandipitously or whatever, having some sort of a media outlet that you own. That you canpartner with him to create content on a podcast is a great one. You know thisshow our shit's. What we use our show be to be growth, for we go ot and weknow that VPS of marketing at BTB tech companies are ideal buyers. And so whatdo you know like all of our guests on BB growth, R, BBS, an marketing an Youcbe teck companies with fifty blo employees like, and so it's a gatewaydrug to a relationship with the exact...

...right type of person. It works locally.It works if you're selling globally, but podcast aren't the only way to doit. I mean you can have you know a video series and you invite someone tobe a part of the video series. I've seen a couple big brands do like theselong documentary style pieces of content, so they're like hour longdocumentaries, I saw an agency in San Diego doing about Seo, saw cybersecurity firm Du one on the four biggest siber security hacks in recenthistory and so you're developing this inphenomenal content. But in the midst of developing that content, you're alsocollaborating with people that you can ultimately do business with to createthat content with them. So it creates this bond in this unity between you andyour potential buyer, because you're creating content with them, be it adocumentary or a podcast episode or a blog or you partner with them on aWebinar thereare, all sorts of different types of media that you cancollaborate with people on and when you're strategic about who youcollaborate with you end up building a business relationship that I canactually have enormous roy well and it also, if you think, about the logisticsof making it happen for larger companies right, it actually helpsbridges. The divide between sales and marketing sales can come in and say,Hey. I want to get into these three, especially in an account Basacty Roch.I want to get have these ten accounts. What can we do to generate content,whether it be podcast interview or some paper or long format, video or thingslike that? It drives that collaboration and actually I think it providesmarketing a hell of a lot better understanding of what it is. Theyshould be putting out to the creative value to begin iller right and you'retotally right, and it's this beautiful, like we're huge advocates for podcast,obviously, and and the way we see it. Bridging that kind of sales andmarketing divide is, you know, sale, says hey. These are the ten accounts Iwant to get into and then marketing owns the podcast itself. So they say:okay, we're going to reach out to decision makers at those ten accountsand we're going to ask them to be a guest on the show, and maybe the personon the sales team is actually does that interview maybe get somebody else doingthe interview, but regardless that person who's a decision maker at TAtarget account that sales wants to get into now has a direct relationship withthe brand because they were a guest on the show, and so maybe their episodegoes live and that sales person then reaches after them. A couple weekslater, like hey just listen to your episode on our podcast, you didphenomenal. I love the part that you said about Dadada would love to chatwith you more about it and that's penetration in the account like, and itdoesn't it's not Rockat sciene it's, but it's adding value upfrontindependent of the product of service that you sell, and you see this a wholelot more than I do being in the space that you're in Shad. But I just see somany people going straight to the throat and going to someone that theyhave zero relationship with whatsoever and trying to sell them their thingproduct service, whatever it is...

...independent of a relationship andbecause of that you just get ignored more often than not. But when you cango to someone and say hey, I have a show I'd love to feature you as anexpert on this show that's value to them, because even if the show doesn'thave very many listeners, it's still great pr for them. They're going to beable to post on linkedin that they were featured on Xyz podcast as an expert,and it makes them look really good, etternally and internally, if they're abig company and so there's benefit in it for them, and your leading withsomething that isn't hey by my thing and and a it's just really powerfulwhell and it's so Yo know we talk about it being almost common sense. You knowhave had these conversations before. What I find interesting is that I thinkif it's the point where it's such common sense for us my career startedin marketnd. I spent the first thirteen years of my career in marketing andthen switchd to sales, and a big chunk of my effectiveness in sales was due tothe fact that I understood how to leverage the marketing content so yeah.Now we got sales. People out there and they're told go hit. These numbers gohit. These numbers go hit these numbers, but they're, not educated, number oneon a methodology to really uncover their prospects view of value, but toprovide them with some type of value in advance. It's not enough. Just to reachout and quote some fancy Stan or Hey, we help this company do for x,imdprovement on whatever, whatever nobody believes that stuff anymore. Youreally have to work on forminat relationship Yep and I think the ideaof collaborating with someone to create content with them actually putting themin the driver seat because essentially you're putting your crossbacks yourfuture customers you're putting them in the driver seat of your contentstrategy, which is just a different way of thinking about it. But if, for ourshow, just keep using the BTB Goth example, we have a show. That's allabout be to be marketing, and so, when I go to a CMO or a VP of marketing at atarget account for US- and I said, hey the shows about BTO b marketing. Isthere anything under that umbrella that you'd be interested in talking aboutand because they're in that role, they're going to have something to say,and so it's not like the content is scattered and all over the place,because you're letting your guests control the content, it's more targetedbecause you're actually talking to practitioners and those practitionerswho are in the weeds like executing on these different strategies and tacticsand different things, are doing in their own business, so you're creatingphenomenal content. But at the end of it I mean after you've kind of preppedthe interview with them. You've done the interview you send them the linkafter the episode went live you now have a real relationship with thatperson. So when you go to email them to say you know hey, I really think wecould help you guys with this thing that you mentioned on the interview:You're not doing it blindly and you're, not doing it independent ofrelationship because of whatever it was that that piece of content was that youcreated with him. You now have a tangible relationship. It goes beyondjust having a piece of marketing collateral to send them. That'srelatively personalized like no like they actually created it with you, andso so you you have such a a meaningful...

...relationship with them. Now and, andwe've done almost eight hundred interviews on BTO be growth. Now andnow our you know, we just hired our first sales person on the team and he'snow a cohost o be to be growth and he's taking over the bulk of the interviewsfor that show, because I want him to have those relationships now and it'sjust phenomenal to see it like go from my business partner and I coasting theshow and now it scales out to you, know somebody that we hired to be in salesin our company doing that and it's working just as well for him as it didfor us because again it it all matter of back to the relationship, and I justdon't see a lot of people telling folks how to actually create relationshipswith people. All they say is the importance of relationships, and yougot to have relationships with like Wy. How do you do that? Oh, this isactually a really simple way to do it like create some sort of content, ubwe've chosen to use podcast and then invite people that you want to haverelationships with to take part in creating that content with you I mean Icould talk about it, Tillin blue in the face, but I just think it's somethingthat, particularly in the B tob space man, because the liketime value of acustomer in the BB space is hi Noso, so to make whatever investmentit is in producing whatever type of content that you're going to use forthis type of collaborative content creation. You close one deal and itpays for a year's worth of content in a lot of Casesno NDSO. You know as youand I were talking off flying. You said that you know the content that you'vecreated from this show. The relationships have been fruitful foryou with your guests, but also the content alone is probably been evenmore valuable to you. So I do a lot of harping on the importance of therelationships with your guests, but the content itself is extremely valuable aswell, and so it's just this it's this double edged sword. I think there's notnearly enough people doing it, and so it's still wide open territory. I thinkthere's a lot of opportunity for growth in it, but I'm really excited about theconcept and the idea of it. Well, an I see you know it's funny. I see a lot ofpeople attempt to do it right, and so you know, I think, when you, when Ifirst start talking, it was like not many podcast make it past episode,seven! Seventy I'm like that, and it's like okay, so we you know you wereright up fromte when we start talking, don't expect you know millions ofpeople overnight yeah, but you see people, that'll, start and it'll catchsomething ill catch. My interest right, Andi'll, listen and then all of asudden it disappears n. Then I get one quick question in my head. Tha goeswell, I wonder what happened and then I completely forget about that show, andit is a it's much like in sales. It's a discipline right, you have to bedisciplined about it and you have to just continue to go through it. Mutaswell have fun doing it. It's more fun to collaborate with somebody than it isto just sit here and write a white paper o something that no bod going toread Ye. I'm curious. I noticed and Wehad you and IA emailed back and forthabout this. The you guys had jumped into some video production yeah andthere was a video and I got to give you huge Kudos, because my one of mybusiness partners probably opens linked... two three times a week and so veryrarely yeah. She ever comment on any piece of content that she sees outthere, but he saw your video that you guys did and came down into. The studiowas like. Have you seen this Yeahav to check this out? So how did thatevolution have yeah yeah? So so we started looking at kind of what. How dowe reapurpose by gues content hote are the best ways to do that, so we startedfiguring out how to do it on Linkdin and it wasn't the traditional thingsthat a lot of people were doing like teasing the content and saying heyyou're, going to learn three secrets on this episode. You know, click the linkhere and listen to it. We notice that when you actually took tangible valuefrom the interview itself and put that into your linkedin status, update thatthose types of post did much better because you were actually giving meatin the post for people to engage with, as opposed to saying hey, I want you tostop scrolling linked in, go, listen to this thirty minute episode or twentyminute episode or whatever it's just disruptive. It's not the regular flowof how people are going to consume. So instead we started saying: okay, whatwere the three biggest takeaways from this episode and we're actually goingto share those three takeaways inside the linkon set us updat itself, and sowe learned a bunch of nuances about how to win on Linkdon and since we werespending. So much time there we saw a lot of people developing video and alot of the videos were really just kind of selfhy like somebody throws up aniphone in front of their face and they start rambling about something thatthey think is important. There was no captions on it. Itwas very lowproduction and I saw saw similar opportunity. I Sai Maan we can, if wecan crush it with linked in status, updates that are text only. I think ifwe, you know, because we're putting more effort into our linked in textnlystatus updates, that's why we're getting results there. So, if we put inmore effort on video, we could probably get more results there as well, and Idid an interview with Gary Vannerchuck about a year and a half ago, and hesaid that the biggest opportunity for B to be brands is to make their buyerslaugh, and I really took that to heart and we started a video series calledGeryv want to be, and it took off righ it was. It was me you know pretendingto be Gary V or trying to be vgery V and failing desperately and and it gotyou know, the series got over eighty thosand views on linkedin. We only didtwo videos and it was phenomenal in terms of engagement, and so we thoughtman what if we started doing this for clients podcasts, where we would do afunny kind of one minute, video explaining what the podcast was about,but we may be humorous, and so I think that's the video that your colleagueactually saw is for a podcast called the payments. Innovation Show, and sowe did a bit on. You know, bitcoin and how everything's changing so fast, andyou know one second, you have to be accepting bitcoin the next. Second, youhave to accept te theoryum and then hope now bit coins out, you got ou, soit's Jis Itas this funny take on how quickly the payment space is changingand... incredible results for them. Theclient ended up, bloving it and they they're now working with us on a longterm basis on producing their show. So all that to say, I just think that theamount of effort you put into it, whether it's a podcast ret purposing,whether it's you know, video production, the amount of effort you put intosomething is directly correlated to the results that you're going to see fromit, and so, if you're, just not willing to put in that effort, you just have tobe okay with limited results, and we just said we just made thedetermination that we were going to put a lot of effort into the content thatwe put out, because we don't want to just kind of set it and forget it. Iwas using buffer and which is a social media tool before and I was justloading in links to different articles and loading them up on Linkdan and Iwas getting you know, a hundred to two hundred views per post, but as soon asI started, writing like thoughtful like long formed status. UPDATES that Iwasn't you know, blasting everywhere, it was just specifically for linked inmy post started, getting like five to ten thousand views and then twentythousand views, and then I had post get over a hundred thousand views, and Iwas like Oh my Gosh Li. This is so much more. You know it's more time. You knowit takes me thirty to forty five minutes to write one of those posts,but it gets such better results than the five minute effort. I was puttinginto loading in links into buffer, and so so we just applied that sameprinciple to video and it ended up working out really really well for us.Well, I think it's important for everybody remember whether you'remarketing or cells or whatever it is the quality of time, not yessoly. Justthe quantity right yeah people are getting more discerning in the contentthat they will or will not, but in time with there's so much of it out there alot of it's okay, someof, crap and then there's great stuff, that's out Yep,and so you know you really it's interesting to see this evolution theway the technology has changed, because marketers have always had to stay onthe front of you know that type of technology, but now even sales people-you have to be a polished professionall, be able to communicate with the writtenword in video and all of that, as well as execute a sales methodology andASELVES yeahess. So the job in order to continually get to the core element ofconnecting with other people and there's so much of it out there todaythat it doesn't take much to turn people off your spot on me and I sawsometman be interestind o get your take on this chat. I saw something yesterday.I think it was on Facebook, where a guy was asking what di they do to set theirsales raps up for success and Scott Chon Dan, and he said, if you can,every rap on your team should have a va to handle all like the administrativelike crm stuff, that sales people hate doing just like take that off theirplate, give it to a va that can handle all that stuff for them. But then hesaid something else and more interesting to me was every one of yourreps should also have a ghost writer, and I thought Oh, my Gosh lecause. Hesaid you know you looking back on all the day that he's Seeng the reps thatcreate content, get ten x results from...

Reps. that don't- and I thought Oh, mygosh like, but the thing that keeps reps from creating content. is theyjust don't have the time to do it? Theyre? You know they're working, O Kno,a large piebind therethey're, getting deals across the finish line, but byhaving a ghost writer if they can just talk through the concepts, eitherquestions that prospects are having that they're finding themselvesanswering a lot or you know whatever it is. They talk through those things. Aghostriter creates the content and the company you know, invests in thatyou're just going to get that much more milege out of your reps, becauseessentially you're paying for them to develop their own personal brand, whichI think is brilliant. I sent it to our sales guy as soon as I saw it, and Iwas like hey man like pick a writer from our team and that person is nowgoing to be your ghostwriter, because I need you writing more content, but I'dbe curious to see if you have a similar thought or if you think that that thisshould be separate or should sales people be creating their own competent.I do look ideal. You want stise people selling. I think it's great. Thereality is most sales. People aren't English majors like I was yeah. Most ofthem, don't have the eye for and the time to think about. What is somebodygoing to find? You know interesting, interesting in a different odium, so tohave a team or people anything that you can all float off of a sales rep, sothey're focused on having the conversations and moving them throughthe sales process. The better off you're, going to be one of the guysfrom outreach that I talked to interviewed last year said that he doeswith his prospect in hi is he does not allow them to go, find their own listsof prospects. He actually has someone who is one hundred percent dedicated tovedting lists, completing them and providing them. So those people arecompletely focused on setting the first meeting and qualifying them for Demo,and their results have been amazing because you have them focused onexactly what they need to be focus on and they're, given the right type ofdata, same thing, yes, sales rat, I think it's brilliant. I wish I had aghostrighter yeah may have the guy o. Now you knowthe Internet has changed, changed how we we do things so much and like and toyour point of like it's the quality that matters, and so these sales rapstat were hiring they're extremely smart. I mean they're, navigating reallycomplex processes, but sales processes and selling complex technology they'reintelligent people that have a lot to say about the industry that they'reselling in and so by equiping them to actually share that expertise and sharewhat they know about the space Bu, giving them a ghostwriter, a copywriterand assigning that person to them. I would argue that one ghostriter couldprobably handle a few different Reps. if that was their job was to you know,just do content, interviews and craft content for these people, and I justthink it would be something that would pay off in big big ways. The longer youkept doing it by well, I o e Potector companyes brand right. So if you havethat's the challenge, wher, you have larger sales FORC. You want to allcreat in content, but some people writ in different vorces different time, yeatheave different, and so you have to reallys as a marketing professional.You have to be really aware of how that...

...impacts. The brand ghostwriter helpsyou get the expertise out of your sales force and also, at the same timeprotect and projact the Maran yeah, which I think is ot on all right man,so I know were short on time an I got. Well, I got to ask you the one question:We ask everybody call it the acceleration insight. So there's onething: You could tell sales marketing people one piece of advice that if theylistened being the Canvia, if they listened, that, you believe would helpthem hit their targets or bust out quotes. What would it be and why it feels like beating a dead horse, butI'm just so bullish on creating content with your prospects and I guess to goone step higher, like figure out a way to add value to your prospects,independent of what you're selling them and and in my opinion, if you canfigure out a way to do that, whether it's you know creating content withthem. Or you know, I've got another business where we sell to high schoolathletic directors and to add value to them. We started thi scholarship, andso we ask athletic directors to nominate two of their student athletesfor an opportunity to win this scholarship and that allows us to youknow it's adding value to them completely independent of the charactercruiculum that we end up wanting. You know we obviously want to sell thatcharacter, curriculum to the athletic director at some point, but to addvalue, andto create a relationship, but then we do something completelyseparate. So that would be my piece of advice, O figure out. What is thatthing that you can add value to your prospect? That has nothing to do that.You know. That's independent! I don't want to say, has nothing to do but isindependent from what you sell and if you can figure that out, I think you'regoing to win perfect James. Thank you so much. If somebody on's Gettin touchwith you. What's the easiest way to do it, yea man, I'm all over Linkdan lastname is car bary and then email is James. SWEETFISH MEDIACOM would love toconnect with anybody and everybody that wants to connect all right man. Ireally appreciate having you on the show. Thank you very much. Thanks Lot,man all right, everybody that does it for this episode check us out of B Tobrevezaccom shared the episode with friends, family coworkers and untilnext time we ha value prime solutions. Wich, you all nothing, but the greatestsuccess felling. The top of the funnel is a challenge, especially in dynamicmarkets, with shifting technology solutions and increasingly informedbuyers. There is no silver bullet to effective prospecting, but value. PrimeSolutions has developed a proven framework and approach that deliversresults, check out value Prime Solutionscom and ask how vortexprospecting can deliver more qualified leads for your teams. You've been listening to the BTOBrevenue executive experience to ensure that you never miss an episodesubscribe to the show in Itunes for your favorite podcast player. Thank youso much for listening until next time.

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