The B2B Revenue Executive Experience
The B2B Revenue Executive Experience

Episode · 4 months ago

Et Tu, Brute?: How Leaders Can Overcome Deceit & Sabotage

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

On a beautiful day in mid-March, you happily stroll into your workplace ready to tackle the most pressing issues facing your organization. You turn to your most faithful advisor and signal it’s time to get to business. All of a sudden, that same advisor, Brutus, starts stabbing you. And everyone else in the senate does, too. This easily makes your top-ten worst Mondays. Why is it that leaders never see betrayal before it happens? 

OK, so maybe it’s not as bad as Caesar, but as a leader in your organization, you need to be prepared to handle betrayal, theft and deceit — which means you need to listen to Today’s guest, Brandon Wilson, President and CEO of Wilbron Inc, and author of Sabotage - Leadership that Overcomes Betrayal, Theft and Deceit

Brandon joins me to share his expertise and be the oracle you need to turn the tide on the Ides of March and avoid ever falling victim to professional sabotage. 

In this episode, we discuss: 

- The importance of thinking in terms of legacy 

- Why leaders often fail to spot sabotage despite how common it is 

- The 4 horsemen of sabotage (and how to spot and stop them) 

Now that you know how to spot sabotage before it happens, are you ready to learn how to employ buyer-first principles or the role data should play in your organization? 

Check out the full list of episodes: The B2B Revenue Executive Experience

You're listening to the BDB revenue executiveexperience, a podcast dedicated to helping executives train their sales and marketing teams tooptimize growth. Whether you're looking for techniques and strategies or tools and resources,you've come to the right place. Let's accelerate your growth in three, two, one. Welcome everyone to the BB revenue executive experience. I'm your host, Chad Sanderson. Today we're talking about leadership, the topic that is constantlyevolving, even more so with the way the business world has been changing thepast two years, with the pandemic and all of the changes to remote versusin person versus cultural impacts. To help us we have with US Brandon Wilson, chairman, President and CEO of Will Brown Incorporated, author of sabotage,leadership that overcomes betrayal, theft and deceit, and frequent contributor to CNNBT and todayshowed a name a few. Brandon, thank you for taking time and welcometo the show. Thanks for having me, Chad. Isn't all righthere, so we always like to ask kind of an off the wall questionjust to get the audience to know you a little bit better. And I'malways curious to know. You know, we spend so much time working andbuilding these work personas. I'm curious to know something you're passionate about that thosethat only know you through work, or maybe only know you through your book, may be surprised to learn about getting personal early. We like to godeep just right out of the gate. You know, that's the that's thefirst way to build a relationship is to go ahead and go deep early soyou can. But the thing that I think that people who only know methrough business might be surprised and know about me is as I am a loverof music. I am passionate about music all coins. I mean from thestandards with Tony Bennett to jazz of Gregor reporter to classic R and be withthe SOS band and anything Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis. I just love musicso much so that, to double down on that, let's get personal.One of the things I most enjoy it's after work or whenever I break awayfrom familial obligations and I'm just driving just to go shopping or goes through somethingpassionate, like a hobby or whatever, go play golf or what have you. On my way to that, to that destination, I often find acool instrumental on the radio and I start rapping nice. I'm very cool,very very cool, and it's something you've done like all your life for somethingyou can into later. Is Music. I'm just there all the time allif I used to be that guy as a kid, like in the cipherfirst, like you see on TV, just freestyling away. I've lost someof the skills as I as I've gotten older, but but it is ait's a passion of mine and and what's interesting about it is not just rappingfor wrappings sake. It has become for me a communications exercise. It providesme with an opportunity to within a measure, to formulate what the next thoughts needto be in the organized them and in a way that fits the cadence. And it's become a really it becomes a really fun game for me thatreally helps me to become a more commuter, more effective communicator as a leader.I love it. I love it and it's a great segue. Imean as a recognized communication and executive consultant, there's no doubt a story of howyour passion for all things leadership developed. So I was kind of hoping you'dshare that with the audience. Well, let me first Ay to delftell offthat last aut is this. So if you want to become a bettercommunicator, listeners, start freestyling. That's...

...the key takeaway that everybody for thepodcast is now going to do. Are Rapping? Yeah, you know,but but it was a great sincerity. You know I care about I careabout your audience, and so I want to spend this time giving your audiencesubstantive things that I've gathered along the way to becoming a more effective leader andbusiness owner and communicate, cater and executive consultant. And to answer your question, you know, my journey began with great mentors. I grew up witha lot of ambitions, a lot of desires, but never had access tothe kind of resources I knew that I know exist today, and that changedwhen I went to college. I had a chance to work in student affairsand work very closely as a student, as a student and we're very closelywith the president, the late William Walker, at Auburn University, Dr William Walker, and learned a lot about some of the challenges that CEO at thatlevel. Face, I will graduate and then I will work for a verypowerful civil rights organization. Their founder was still there. He founded the organizationthen, some thirty ARD years ago, so I had a chance to reallysort of dive deeply and richly into his experiences and starting that organization. Wetraveled a lot with one another and I remember one day told me said ready, you got everything it takes to be an incredible business leader and you shouldstart your your own business, and I walked away, never feeling more flatteredfor being fired. I said, man, if you want to fire me,just tell me to leave ladder me out the door. But he wasserious. He can't bring it up to me. And this, this thisstatement, changed my thinking about entrepreneurship and also changed my thinking about leadership.He said, let me tell you why I started this civil rights organization,and he told me the story of his passion for building something that will shapethe world for the people he loved. And he said, bringing if yousay you won't, don't want to be a businessman, you don't like entrepreneurship, at least do it because you the people you love deserve and engine forgood. And I never forgot it. I immediately, I think the nextday, went and registered in LLC called Wilbrin and and it was found asa higher education think tank. And the work that I was doing then wasproviding consultancy to college presidents all across the country. So when they called thiscivil rights attorney, he would send the college presidents will call them, theywould send them my way and out. It provided me with a chance togain even more mentors and that were an and to provide them with advice totheir most pressing challenges. And made a company out of it. We scaledand we grew. We became a full size advertising and community cations agency asa result. But one of the things that experience taught me, or itgave me, was access to really influential and powerful leaders throughout my entire career. And one of the things that I realized is that when they're three typesof leaders, I mean there are leaders who think about getting things done,and I've work with those. Their leaders who get things done for the sakeof getting things done, like we I've been asked to do this and Isaid I would do it, I'm going to get it done. And thenthere are leaders who get things done because they know that it could change things, that it can change their environment, could change their situation, could changethe world. And I noticed that the...

...higher and influence all the leaders Iworked with, they thought about execution and leadership with a certain sense of urgencybecause they knew the consequences of failure. And so our convert my conversations withthose leaders will oftentimes talk about legacy. They will often talk about why fail. You're in an option. And then, when talking about the barriers for thoseleaders to seceding this concept of leadership, sabotage kept coming up over and overagain. People defying them, corporate abuse, people wanting to exact revengeon them, reputation assassination, credibility assassination, I mean the list goes on andon and on. Theft, even disingenuous promotions those people, even ornot. I had to see your one time tell me if you want toget rid of an employee, the best way to do it is to givethem a promotion and you know, just to give them enough for rope tohang themselves. And there's signs and there's signs that you can point to,and I've been put in the position. They help leaders at all levels pointto the identify those signs and those barriers and those saboteurs before they strike them, so that they can continue to lead effectively and do transformative work well.And so, all right, let's talk about that at bit. So there'salways signs. Some people are better at catching them than others. But whenit comes to being an environment where there is that leadership, sabotage or makemay give birth to that. What are some of those early warning signs thatleaders should be paying attention to? There are many, but I want tocorrect something that you just said, that that many leaders, some leaders,are better at than seeing the signs that others. I will dare say toyou few leaders are good and we're going to just bring the truth. Wejust bring the truth from now and all right, and that's why sabotage isable to persist, because it, you know, those who agents of sabotage, or Sabo Tours, if you want to call them that, are bankingon the fact that that you don't know the signs, that you don't knowwhat they're up to, and that's why I persist. I mean there's datathat shows, at least in my experiences, one out of every three leaders thatI speak with has faced leadership sabotage. One and every three, and evena few of that, probably one of every very have the skills neededto to overcome them, and some just sheer look. So I'm by instinct, but I wrote a book called sabotage, leadership that overcomes betrayal, theft anddeceit, because I realized that there was a leadership gap. It wasa discipline gap. That exists a lot of books. You can go tothe bookstore right now, you can walk up and down the als and youcan find all kind of powerful leadership books, powerful business books, powerful executive managementbooks, and they talk about rising early, they talk about working hard, they talk about all of those things, but I think they there's not enoughcontent, if any. There's very few, if any, that preparesthat leader who rises early, has vision and wants to work hard to preparefor the spook behind the door waiting to trip them up as they come in. It's seven o'clock in the morning. Yeah, the signs that you canlook for. My book calls them the for Horsemen of sabotage and in myresearch and even in my own experiences of being sabotage. All acts of sabotage, whether they be an act of betrayal and active fell toward active deceit,fall into one of four categories and I call each of those categories, youknow, horsemen of sabotage, and the four horsemen of sabotage are things tookthat leaders can look to to see the early signs, and they are jealousy. Whenever you encounter somebody who has a penchant for the meaning the gains ofothers or diminishing the gains of others verbally,...

...and it may not be to you, then you know that you're dealing with someone who has a penchant forbeard, for being jealous. And so whenever you see that Horseman Ride IntoYour Life, there're things that you can do to fortify your pursuits and yourleadership in your life from the ax that are acts of sabotage that are driven, motivated or fueled, if you will, by jealousy. The other horsemen isarrogance. We see these leaders, we see these by time all thetime and you know, arrogance these no introduction. It introduces itself. Butyou know, arrogant, arrogant folks, arrogance as a horse is a horsemanand it rise into our allies and it does certain things. It's different,it does different things than jealousy, arrogance, does other undertakes, other types ofsabotage in our lives. The other one is lying, liars, thepeople who will have a high penchant for lying and lying, and all ofthese have levels. Lying has levels as well. There's there are people wholie for the sake of of distraction, to get attention off of them,to say hey, look over there, and then there's another level of lying, which is lying to harm others, where you literally throw other people underthe bus. Yeah, when gay, a reckless disregard for the harm thatyou might do just so that you can satisfy yourselfish intent and then the lasthorseman is seduction. And whenever you see the seducers come in our lives,and I'm not talking romantic seduction, even people who are in it's all complete, most of its platonic. They have will manicured personifications, will manicured reputationsand they are always dressed to the tea, to the dime, to the nine. beat very ambitiously about things, and we do that too as leaders. Every day. But what makes it jump into the level of seduction isthat they utilize that appearance and that crafted those crafted environment that they wrap themselvesaround to encourage you to go along often unethical rides. They really don't careif the means justify the end and they find great pleasure not on the journeybut getting you to join them in the journey. I mean, we cando this, we can get away with it, it's going to be fun. Fine, just jump on it. Fine, you break it down inthat way. Even your gas, I'm sure, are started. Think aboutyeah, you know, there are people in my mist who exhibit some ofthose behaviors. And being able to think about where you are and think aboutyour leadership is not a matter in that way. Is Not a matter ofparanoia, is a matter of wisdom, because the more potent you become asa leader, the more consequential your leadership that comes. What I mean bythat is you are literally the driving force to provide better education to underserved communities, to feed kids who might be dealing with food and securities, to takea corporation two places that's never been in order to keep the industry relevant fortechnological changes. I mean and these are real things, and so by lettingany of those horsemen stop you, you are literally letting saboteurs rob those children, Rob Those customers, rob those whoever you're out to impact from the benefitsof your effective leadership. I love it. I love it, and that actuallyleads into an into a great segue.

You're one of the few people that, when we've prepped some of the material that I got in advanced talkedabout legacy, talked about shaping a legacy and I think oftentime times, especiallyin corporate America Day, everybody's looking at the next quarter, the next quarter, the next quarter. They're not thinking about the true impact of that wordof the things they're doing now and what that may mean for the future.Some mighty even argue we're seeing that with climate change, but that's a differentpodcast. So when we when we talk about shaping that legacy, what doesthat mean in terms of changing the way a leader approaches leadership into or thebehaviors or actions that they should be putting into play? A phenomenal question,because at the foundation of leadership is legacy. And we don't, I don't,I don't think we start thinking about legacy soon enough. I just don't. There was a leader that helped me really put this into words. Orher name is Carolyn Johnson. She shared it with one of my mentors heshared with me. Is it that, if we had to define what legacyis, it's is setting in motion a series of activities that causes erreversible impact. Thought about it that way and often when you're thinking about the next quarter, the next quarter, the next quarter, the next sale, the next sale, the next sale, you're literally placing the energy that powers your leadershipinto the power of a transaction. But there's so much more you're leaving onthe table. There's so much more for people who who say Oh, whichis all of us who are salespeople, I think that thinking about the thingsyou're selling as a legacy defining exercise allows you to to do more than justtransact money for a widget, but you literally are able to tie that thingyou're selling to the way that it will change lives and communities, and that'sa whole other value proposition and a whole different discourse to have with the prospects, and we don't have that conversation enough. Even if you are a middle manageror early an entry level employee. If you can get your leaders,even if you're at that level, to articulate to you why the things thatthey're asking you to do are so incredibly important, then what you do isyou're forcing them to align all of their thinking around legacy or irreversible impact activities, and I think I don't think we do that enough. And as sortof a practical example, there is a leader I'll give you too. There'sa leader by the name of Byed Rushton. You may or may not have heardof that. Leader, by a Rushington and incredible, probably one ofthe world's most potent community organizers. This leader saw a need to assemble amassive amount of people in the mall in DC and he went and said,hey, we going to have the largest protests in the s in the mallin Washington DC and we're going to symble all of those people to make surethat our voices are heard with regard to taking on Jim Crow Laws and promotingintegration. He said this to another leader, who is a Philip Randolph. APhilip Randolph was an executive leader, at executive letter level, leader andestablished leader. He said to buy ARD or each he spoke about what buyour Rushton was after in a different way. He said no, we're not goingto us. We're not just merely...

...getting millions of people to go tothem all and Washington. We are using the mall in Washington as the world'sbiggest stage to make sure that we have the loudest and megaphone to speak tocongressional leaders about the need to make a difference in the world by making amiracle, a model for integration the world over. Those are very two differentthings. So if you apply that in a practical sense, then you startto understand that as a prospect, I'm listening to a Philip Randolph thinking howcan I join you? I need to do and you show up here thatI have a dream speech. But there are those are two different leaders afterthe same thing. One is really focused on legacy and they speak about itin different ways. Another example is Steve Jobs. Steve Jobs, it wasliterally just building a computer, but to him he was doing so much more, and there's a great story as well documented John scully from Pepsico, who'sa transactional leader. I mean you see sale soda, you get money,you seel so many and I, like PP se, I call you,but you sell, so do you get one? Steve Jobs thought it wassomething nobler, so much something much more noble to pursue and what he wasselling. So they were at odds, which led to John scully essentially sabotagingSteve Jobs. If Steve Jobs didn't have the critical skills that we're talking aboutnow for overcoming sabotage or for protecting his leadership pursuits and his life from sabotage, we may never see the iphone, we may never have the met bookpro that we have today and the vision he saw. He the line theseactivities with providing each of us, to ordinary person, with the tools necessaryto change the way that we engage with the world and how the world engageswith us. I love it. I love as a salesperson, if yougo into a meeting and say that this device is going to fundamentally change theway you engage with the world, you got a sale. First I wantone which a lot of people said right, I love said that's all right.So let's Change Direction here a little bit. We ask all of ourguests two standard questions towards the end of each ennery. The first is simply, as a chairman, president, CEO and author. That makes you aprospect for a lot of people out there. A lot of people want to gettime on your calendar and when you don't have a trusted referral and somebodythat you know says, Hey, you should really talk to this person,I think they can add value. When you don't have that what works foryou, when somebody's trying to capture your attention and earn the right to timeon your calendar. I get a lot of paintings from folks and you knowwhat, since those who are most effective, apart from from the rest, arethose who call me and they express care and concern for me. They'veunderstood our business, they understand a little bit about me and they don't.It's not about the phone call, is not about the product more so thanit is about learning more about about me and my journey, what interests anddrives me. And I am like many executive, and I will go andrecord and say many executives are open to entertaining and investing time into, intothe intellectually curious, and that's why we...

...have all these administrative assistants because ifyou, if you get to us, we're going to be quite generous withtheir time. Right. So curiosity, a care and a concern for forhow we are doing, what we are achieving and what we desire to dobeyond the present. I love it. That's that is great. So lastquestion. We call it our acceleration insight. If you could give one piece ofadvice, just one, to sales, marketing and professional services people, onepiece of advice that, if they listened, you believe would help themhit their targets or exceed them. What would that one piece of advice beand why? Oh, top of my head. Easy, use your timenot to sale products, but in stay at use your time to purchase relationships. Ha Ha. That's going to be one of the quotes they're going topull out, brother, I'm telling you right now, I know I'm marketingteams going to pull that out. that. That is very well said, veryvery well said. All right, brand if you if somebody wants tofind the book, where's the best place for us to send him to findthat sabotage book? Brandon Wilson Dot Co again, that's Brandon Wilson Dot CEO, and you can go there, you can get the book and hope it'sa blessing to each and every one of you as you strive to become moreeffective leaders. Also, at Brandon Wilson Dot Com, you can reserve fifteenminutes on my schedule and tap into other leadership insights. If there are somechallenges or some questions or some things going on around you that you just don'tknow how to navigate through, go to Brandon Wilson dotcom get time on myschedule and I am one of those leaders. Again, was generous about those whowant to a lot more, and so go to Brandon Wilson Dot codeabout a book and gain access to me. I love it brand. I can'tthank you enough for taking time. It's been an absolute pleasure to haveyou on the show. It's been my pleasure, all my pleasure. Allright, everybody that does it for this episode, you know the drill.Check it out of BB REV exactcom, share with friends, family, Coworkers, leave us a review if you like what you're here and until nexttime, we have value selling associates which we all nothing but the greatest success. You've been listening to the BB revenue executive experience. To ensure that younever miss an episode, subscribe to the showing itunes or your favorite podcast player. Thank you so much for listening. Until next time,.

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