The B2B Revenue Executive Experience
The B2B Revenue Executive Experience

Episode · 2 months ago

Level Up Your Sales Enablement Strategy w/ Sales Engagement 3.0 w/ Roderick Jefferson


Most people understand sales training, but what about enablement? That’s just what you use for when something is broken on your sales team, right?

Wrong. The fact is, sales enablement is essential to every organization — and it’s time we structured our companies to reflect that. It’s time we moved onto sales enablement 3.0.

My guest today not only coined the term “sales enablement,” he’s now pioneering its revolution to 3.0. Roderick Jefferson, Vice President, Field Enablement for NETSKOPE and author of the new Amazon bestseller "Sales Enablement 3.0 ” joins me to discuss the secrets to sales enablement success.

Now that you understand why sales enablement 3.0 matters, are you ready to finally figure out how to bring up challenges at work or learn to transform your sales org with data and technology? Check out the full list of episodes: The B2B Revenue Executive Experience .

You're, listening to the DB revenueexecutive experience, a podcast, dedicated ale executives, train theirsales and marketing teams to optimize growth, whether you're looking fortechniques and strategies were tools and resources. You come to the rightplace: Let's accelerate your growth in three to one for every one to the B tob revenue executive experience. I'm your host Chad Sanderson today we'retalking about sales, enablement, the impact it can have on an organization.What is it really why it's so critical and really important how to evolve it?To version three point: Oh, to help us we have with US Rodrick Jefferson, vicepresident field, enablement for net scope and author of the new Amazon,best seller sales, enablement, three dot. Oh the blueprint to sales and ablement excellence roderick. Thank you so much for taking time and welcome to theshow God my absolute pleasure, thanks for having me on yeah, so we alwayslike to start with kind of an off the wall question to help our audience getto know you a little bit better. Then I'm always curious to know somethingyou're passionate about that. Those that may only know you from the book orfrom work might be surprised to learn about you. There are actually a coupleof things. One is being a Texan, barbecuing, absolutely love it. Icreate my own rub my own sauce. We ve got the big drum smoker, so out theredoing everything from ribs to chicken, to you know the brisket etcetera right,so that's one. The other is really surprising and for most people that Idon't understand, it's a game called Bachi, think about large marbles out on thecourse and look I'm down for any activity where one it doesn't hurt thenext morning and to you can do with a cocktail in your hand. Absolutely absolutely have you played Bachi yourentire life that something you came to later. How did you can now? It'sactually later so my wife is Irish. Italian. We would go up to hergrandfather's house every fourth of July as a family and as a formerathlete I like to win, and so I went up and I played her grandfather and gotwaxed year over year, and I thought how is this old guy just killing me and sofrom there we built a new home and I actually have a regulation botchy courtin my back yard, now yeah. I know I'm a little competitive. That's awesome! That's awesome allright! So, let's talk sales enablement, so help us understand how this hasbecome such a passion, eers. Well, it started way back. I started as a salesperson, first and foremost right and I went through the on boarding and allthe programs that most people did way back, which was standardized trainingand I was a BR. I was an ae and then I got promoted to sells leader andactually turned it down, because I realized I loved the process of sellingmore than I did taking down deals, and I didn't want that quota hanging. Op Mein a morning is- and so I talked myself into my first sales training roll backat Att- and I said, look what if I could take my rudimentary templets and roll it out across the entire regionand get more people to club, which I had been to a couple of times at thatpoint and also get people up to speed, faster and more act, and so my vp said.Well, then you got a new job, and so I talked myself into my first cellstraining job and from there moved forward, and it became sells an ablemanabout seventeen years ago and little known fact, I'm actually the personthat coined the phrase sales, an Ableman, no kidding yeah- I am it wasactually. I was honestly in the midst of being a smart ass and I having aconversation with my sales leader, and he said: We've got a problem withdiscovery, qualification, throw more training at it. Our people arediscounting too deeply because they can't handle objections, throw trainingat it. Our leaders aren't able to handle the load. We need to throw moretraining, and I said no actually, you train animals. You enable people...

...from there became the genesis of salesand Ableman, because it's so much more than just training. So absolutely andSola- that's a perfect sigwe. So for those I mean it's been around for awhile right, some seventeen years to be a a ten here's and many people, youknow, have heard the term of experience that have come to contact with salesand abime groups. I think for some there is still a those that aren't init. There's a question as to how do you define it? What really is it so fromyour perspective, especially with the new books, so them at three ato? How doyou define it? How do you define effective sales and ammen? Oh, it'sfunny because initially, the description of it has changed now thatwe're into coved and going into that three too face so before I'd say whatis sales? An able really do, and I get that question a lot I'd say it's aboutbreaking the complexity of sales, into practical ideas through scalable andrepeatable practices that will lead to accelerate it to me to revenue,increase seller productivity and ultimately, customers for life drivingmore increased revenue. Well Times is shifted now and now, with the cellsstable met, three doto focus. It's really more. An innovative approachfocused on increasing cells, productivity through a systematic,personalized and collaborative approach designed to support the buyer throughwhat I call the conversation economy, so it's gone from us being, or at leastmoving from us being seen as kind of the fixers of broken things. If youwill it's broken, throw training at it right into really being woven into thefabric of the company, and it has to be a part of any definitive component of acompanies go to market strategy. Now it's a differentiator when donecorrectly yeah, there's the key right when done correctly it definitely andto always had that Cavino. Here's, the interesting thing when you ask peoplewhat sells an element is, if you ask- and I say in the book, If you ask tenpeople, you'll probably get twelve answers, and none of those answerswould be wrong, but none of them would be completely right either, becausewhat sells an ableman means to a company is defined by where the companyis in their maturation and growth cycle as a company example, if you're inhyper growth, what do you focused on on boarding? So that's going to be thebane of enablement for you as you grow and you become more of a complex sale.Now you got to look at the messaging, the positioning. How do we make surethat the leaders are in tune? What's your selves process, sales methodologyand ultimately how's this time back to the buyers journey right now, when youget to that big ticket item, that relationship sell it all changes onceagain. So again, it depends on where you are and where the pendulum sits inthat swing of maturation, for your company hope that answers it yeah, Iknow that's beautiful and- and you hit on a key point there I want to go alittle bit deeper on is, is the impact that sales in averment can have on thebuyers buyers journey, because a lot of people when you when they think ofwhere sales and ament sits inside of a large enterprise, they might feel likeit's a step or to remove from the face to face with buyers themselves so helpthe audience understand how effective sales enablement will actually enhancethe buyers journey. Oh absolutely great question so again, I said before it wasabout time to revenue and all those things. Well, let's see what coved hasdone differently to the buyers journey. First of all, there's never been a morepersonalized time and selling than today we're inviting each other intoour homes. Now the Zuman and other pieces. So it's not like. Okay, let'sgo have TAKTA. Let's go play golf we're out in open air we're out publicly. Ihave to now treat you as a warm and welcome guests into my home, whichmeans I now need to figure out how to have conversations instead of givingpresentations and that begins with the buyers journey in element. The ultimateimpact is, and a woman is not about getting the right answers. It'sliterally about teaching our sellers. How to ask the right questions.Absolutely! I could not agree more, and..., when we do that right, that's thesales process has become some would say complex. I feel like it hasn't. Youknow, has really change, we've done it to ourselves, yeah. We we made it morecomplicated than it needs to LE and there's a lot of. I don't know. I don'tknow the right now, just a lot of levers that you could pull in thatsales process to dial it in and I'm always curious. You know we work with alot of sales, enablement organizations and they come in different varieties.They come in those that that believe that they should be the one stop shopfor everything and contain all of the expertise across you know crossfunctional communication and sales and Revenue Generation. Things like that orthose that take a strategy where they want to internalize and own things interms of accelerating the enablement across the team, the region, theorganization and will bring in experts in specific areas to help accelerate oramplify their own efforts, which one do you think is more effect. I don't knowthat one's right or wrong, just kind of curious. Your perspective on what youthink about. Should sales enablement be relied, you know making themselves aone, stop shop or working collaborate when it makes sense with externalexperts. I think that what the approach I take is a mix of the two. So let megive you a story of how I explain enablement to folks that are outside ofthe space or even outside, of tech, et Cetera that don't know what enablementis at all. I don't even use the word. I sink think about an orchestra right.You've got brass, percussion, strings, wood, winds and they're all trying toplay this song together, but they're kind of out of tune, sometimes they're,stepping on top of each other. There may be out of fate, so let's relatethat now to business. Those lines of business would become sales, marketing,product marketing, product management, engineering, H, R and enablement. We'reall trying to do the right thing for the prospect of the customer, butwithout coordination, we're also stepping on top of each other left hand,doesn't know, what's going on with the right hands, I'm to absolutely until inboth situations. One personal organization which I believe it sellsenablement the conductor steps up taps the stand, not all of that noise andchaos becomes a beautiful sheet of music. I love that analogy. I love theanalogy, and, and I one hundred percent agree with the organizations that Ihave seen be the most effective with sales name is when sales enablement isthe. I don't want to use the word glue because that in Ployer Day at anoth andwe do- and that requires not only an understanding and expertise inorganizational management, organizational process, understandingto some extent what each of the other functional units inside an ourorganization from marketing the customer success or whatever do so.That brings up a really interesting question, because back in the day, Ican remember people saying Oh sales and neighbor ent people need to have atleast sold, but I feel like today, the skill set because of the criticality ofit being the hub. The skill set for being effective in sales and elementhas has gotten more complex, and so, when you think of the profile ofsomebody who would be great in sales name it or maybe that you look to hiredto bring on to your teams. What are you looking for skill set and personalitywise? Well, it's interesting because every company focuses on their Ip right,their ideal customer or client profile, and they usually have it pretty dialedin a nail I'm going to give another academ, because the world needs moreright and that acronym is, I e p the ideal employee profile and so I'll give it to you from twoangles: one from an able man and then one from the sales it on enablement. Idon't hire anyone on my team that has not carried a bag and it's simplybecause of two things, one credibility of being able to say I've walked inyour shoes. I have sold I've lost blue birds of landed. I pulled out Wales andI'm set at the thirteenth hour at the end of a month and quarter waiting fordocu signs. Just like you, Mr Missis seller, right, that's one piece, theother side is you can't flub someone that has done your job yeah. We allwent through carrying a bag. We all...

...went through on board and we all satthrough different workshops that we didn't want to go into the first timeand then we all saw some value out of some of them and I won't say all, butsome of them right and so now, let's align that to your cellar memberearlier I talked about the maturation cycle of the company. Well, in thatearly stage you can get those younger green horns and BDRA and SDRs and suchthat are just kind of kicking out your product. But then, when you get intothat complex sale, you need someone more mature that can now talk about keydifferentiation, competitive advantage, business value and then, when you getto that deeper side, you need someone. That's very season that not onlyunderstand your Ip and what's top of mine, but can I ball them and say: LookI get what you're doing we've done this with others: You're, not a Guinea pig,we're not hoping that it works, and I can give you examples and references ofwhere that works. Absolutely the part of it that I always find reallyinteresting when I work with these organizations. Is that there's just asmuch focus on or should be just as much focus on the buyer and enabling thesales teams to have those conversations? Ask the right questions. Keep thesolution in your pocket. If you will, instead of just you know, run out thereand talk about US versus also the the savvy the experience, the the people,interaction, the organizational I don't like the word politics, but on managingthe ebb and flow of killing Bo. Let's call it what it is: the politics, the O non politicalorganization out there that has no politics right, minimize or they may becovert, but they're there yeah, absolutely and then the sales. Anelement team has to be able to navigate that in a broader spectrum across theorganization, then say somebody WHO's, siloed N, like I only work in marketingright, and so these teams, the ones that I've seen be very effective andI'm continually impressed with, are extremely excellent communicators andunderstand how to navigate the pitfalls that you're, naturally going to haveinside of an organization. Sometimes I think that skill set can't be taughtnecessarily do you think people that are carried but in I can be fostered. Idon't think it can be taught, and I just hit on two words that I love right.One is navigate and the other is communication. So in the book I you runthe entire chapter. On that whole orchestra analogy, I gave you yeah andit's communication collaboration, then orchestration right. A lot of folks tryto go to that. Third One without the first two and now around the navigatepiece. It's literally why this philosophy of three doto exists becauselook prior to this it was we were going. We were kind of hoping we're doing theright things. We hit the right mark. Our metrics were vanity metrics that Icall but on seats and Smiley sheets right now let come on, let's be honest, even fiveand people, and we got a four point: six that and seven bucks will get you aLotta right I'll talk about metrics later, because that's something that'sa whole other world into itself. But back to this piece right sells anevomit. Now it's only me through Tato has become both in art and a science,because there's no magical silver bullets, there's no single approach,that'll guarantee that you'll be successful right. However, I believethere is a formula just like any other success program, successful process,program or tool that requires kind of a combination of practical application,trial and error, and a mix of a lot of conversations with all of those linesof business to understand their wants, their needs and their expectations. Andonce you do that, then it'll help you as a sell, an able met practitioner tonavigate the twists and turns that will ultimately lead to designing, deployingmeasuring and, of course, iterating. A world class sells an Ave, midorganization that now- and I say this from the bottom of my heart- to thesales enablement practitioners to the sales folks to all of the lines ofbusiness that are listening.

Unless you carry a bag, stop saying youdrive revenue, you do not we impact and we influence revenue unless you've gota quota, you don't drive remeny exactly exactly so. Okay. So now, let's talkabout the future right, because we've seen sales and am might go through anevolution over the last seventeen years. What's the future hold, I think thefuture and I'll give you another analogy. Do you remember the oldcartoon, the jetsons? Yes? Okay, so they had the robot. They had flyingcars. All of that right, so the jesses were actually set in our time frame nowof what they taught it was going to be so I'll. Take that analogy and now tieto enablement. We are now sitting on a number of tools that will scale andautomate in ways that have never been seen before we're actually includingthings like AI and m l in our metric piece of enablement. As I said earlier,the future were no longer seen as the fixtures of broken things and brokenpeople were no longer seen as schedules and coordinators. We are truly sittingas part of a center piece and hub in the go to market strategy that startsat the buyers. Journey drops down to your selfs process and methodologydrops down to your self stages, then drops down to all of your assets frommarketing and product marketing and then finally, at the base line isenablement of all of the activities. It's an ongoing occurrence. It's not asingle event, and so I give this analogy quickly or ce me. This storyquickly, and it goes a little about this with training. It's a it's asprint when enablement the future of it's a marathon. So when you want, whenyou think about a Neighborin, I want to change the mindset and look atenablement from this angel. It should be involved in a front talentacquisition and that entire interview process. Why? Because we are going tounderstand things besides whether or not folks a quota, and we have a muchhigher bs filter because we deal with sellee every day, right Ben. It shouldgo into it'll, go into consistent on boarding which is role specific right,one's too deep and then not deep enough for others from there. Then it's theongoing occurrence of constantly sharpening that sword, so we're notsending our cellars out proverbially to war with a plastic spoon. The nextpiece that gets left out is coaching and reinforcement for our leaders onhow to be a leader, not just be a manager right and then the next is themeasurements that I talked about earlier and finally, another piece thatgets left out and I see this becoming more important and that is successionplanning. Now that is the path in the stairway to enablement, as we move intothree doto versus just training people and hope that it works excellent. Allright. So, let's Pivit here and talk a little bit about net scope, tell usabout what you do, what the company's all about, how you got there sure weare a cybersecurity company and working in both networking and and securityacross the board. How I got here was interesting enough. They were actuallyinterviewing someone else for the war, and now this is where I say your networth is determined by your network and that person was happy where she was,but she said I know the absolute perfect person for where you guys arehe's been through fourteen m NA activities, because we're pripet beenthrough fourteen in a activities this guy created, enavant he's got fromsmall companies to large companies. He's done this that and the other rightI talked to them. On a Monday. By Friday I talked to nine people. ByMonday I had an offer a the next week. It was the perfect hand and glove fitit's not because I'm wonderful, it's more of it was the perfect time for theperfect fit in the perfect company, great culture, amazing people growinglike a weed at sixty percent plus year. Over year, moving towards I peal atsome point but most importantly, it was really focused on customers. I don'tmean just customer centric fringe quotes right, but we really dod careabout our customers and we care about...

...something important to me, which isdiverse, ty equity inclusion, and I don't mean trying to do the right thing.I mean doing the thing because it's right so all of that came together andthey didn't have enablement before I walked in. They simply had training andthey were viewed its kind of schedules, coordinators and the fixers of brokenthings and people. As I say, we now have a full blown enablement programthat is fit and growing into the future, and when I got out of the interview whyI came here was they said: Let's make our enablement function, the use casefor everything you talk about in the book. I love it. I love it all right.So, let's put it- and I know I'm going off script off off the questions. Isend you little bit here now. Let's talk about the book by talk about theGenesis of the of what I mean: Writin Books, no small task, so no riding lookis painful as a male. It is the closest thing we will ever do to giving birth.It is painful, and I mean painful that third trimester of writing this book. Icould find time to do anything. Can I watch the car? Do you want me to govacuum? Do you want to go at the grass anything to do somebody? What I firedyou to tackle it that you know there's a couple things one was, as I came upin the enablement game. I never had a blueprint to follow, so I learned hownot to do things a lot right, and so I wanted to give a blueprint for those that were coming up also for those that are practitionerstoday, I wanted to give you some tools. Some templates, some real life example,practical application stories, and I talk about where I failed in this booktoo. It's not all UNICORNS and rainbows all right, I'm like look. This is whatyou don't want to do. I tried it, it does not work out well awesome and I'msure it will be a great value to anybody who picks up, especially forsales, namely because I know a lot of people that struggle with trying tofigure out how to put it together, so definitely make sure yeah. You pick upthat book, everybody. Let me go say I it's not just for sales. An ableman,though I wrote the book as the Orchestra Master, because I talk abouthow do you collaborate with all of the other lines of business, and I talkdirectly to the lines of business of what the value is of enablement ofworking with them as that conductor? So I don't want to box it for jest sellsand am it practitioners, I think, across your organization, there's valuein this yeah. So you definitely understand what it is sells. An ablemanis and work more effectively with them. Absolutely absolutely so, let's ChangeDirection here, a little bit. We ask all of our guess two standard questionstowards the NOVAC interview. The first is simply as an executive. That makesyou a prospect for somebody out there. I'm always curious. Indeed, I think acouple of people may have figured that out bike that, and he and when you knowsomebody doesn't have a trusted referral into you, what works for youif somebody's trying to capture your attention and earn the right to time onyour calendar? How about this? Let me give you two answers her: What not todo and then how to actually Gara our attention. What not to do don't send mea cold email out of the blue. That essentially reads: I can't believe yourcompany exists without our product or solution or service. That is an instantdelete. It do some homework make it. I said earlier selling has never beenmore personalized, then today, personalize. This show that this is notjust some form letter that you put into male chip and it's sent off to me orwhatever your package is, and you sent off to me in eight thousand otherpeople personalized a hey. I saw that your company now just moved from threebillion to seven point: Five Billion IPO. I understand some of the problemsthat comes with that kind of girl. I so you guys are in higher growth mot we'veworked with company Sumie to yours. Okay, now you've got my attention. Youactually did some homework right right and also. Secondly, don't send me your for email streams. That say I guess youdidn't have time to read my last o a leary. It's not important, then why areyou sending this to me? I learned...

...something from from my buddy JohnBarros, who runs JB, training right and John Always said if you reach out justto check in or touch basis, what you're saying to your prospect is I bring novalue to you so delete anything that I think, and I absolutely agree with thatstatement now what to do. As I said, take some time. Personalize thingslearn a little bit about enable me, learn a little bit about the companyand then send something out. That is, you know, a look like: We've workedwith people in your industry, such as, and I hate when people say, we'veworked with companies like yours, my immediate response to them is like who,and what exactly is my company like that you've worked with, because wehave a pretty unique go to market strighe yeah you have to you, have toknow who you're reaching out to a yeah. You can't make it sound like and here'sthe other thing reach out from the stance of I want to help you not sellsomething to yes, I was just having a conversation with somebody about that.The is looking where I'm not in sales, I'm in problem solving. That's what Ido. If you got problems, I can help you with great. If you don't, you got otherproblems, maybe I know somebody who can help you, I'm not here, to sell youanything here to help solve your problems, all right. So last question:We call it our acceleration insight. If there's one thing, you could tell salesmarketing anybody in the organization. One piece of advice you could give themthat, if they listened to, you believe would help them hit were exceed theirtargets. What would it be and why you cannot exist? You will not besuccessful as a silo organization. What you have to do is communicatecollaborate in orchestrate together, based upon the needs of the customernot trying to sell them something when you start working together, thisbecomes a beautiful sheet of music. When you don't it's just noise andchaos, I love it all right Roger. Where do wesend them to get the book? So you can find the book sells a Elemi three Dodo,the blueprint e s sels an able and excellent, or you can just go on Amazonand search for my name, Roderick Jefferson, it's on Amazon, it's onbarns and noble. It's on Walmart Cobo, all the fun stuff, it's out there inhard copy in paperback and also e book, and I'm going to break some big news.We are on the verge now of finishing up the recording for the audio book, whichwill drop shortly, nice excellent and if somebody wants to talk to youspecifically about sales and element, learn more about the topics or anythingwhere's the best place for us to send them. I always say if you can't find meon social media you're, not really trying, because you find me on Linkin at Roder,Jefferson on Instagram at Roderick underscore underscore sociate, or youcan find me on twitter at the Voice of Rod, Nice all right, excellent Roderick.I cannot thank you enough for taking the time to be with us today. This hasbeen a great conversation. Thank you, my absolute pleasure, thanks for havingme on and happy selling to everyone out there all right, everybody that does itfor this episode. You know the drill be to be reezon share with friends, family,Co workers. You like what you here, give us a review on itunes. Until nexttime we have valesi associates with all nothing, but the greatest success. You've been listening to the B TVRevenue Executive Experience to ensure that you never miss an episodesubscribe to the show in Itunes or your favorite podcast player. Thank you somuch for listening until next time, e.

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