The B2B Revenue Executive Experience
The B2B Revenue Executive Experience

Episode · 1 year ago

How to Land Your Company on the First Page of Search w/ Chris Dickey

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

You have a great product. You know who your audience is and how to help them solve their problems. Now you just need to get in front of them. You need brand saturation — and these days, that means getting into Google’s top 5 search results.

To help you learn how to do that, in the latest episode I sat down with Chris Dickey, Founder and CEO of Visably, a company focused on helping organizations manage their brand visibility in search.

What we talked about:

  • Why organic search traffic is the key to brand strategy
  • The challenge of unseating large brands like Amazon in search (and how to get around it)
  • Why brand is built by every team in your organization

Once you figure out how to land your company that top search position, are you ready to dive into how AI is revolutionizing content marketing or how to get the most out of your CRM? Check out the full list of episodes: The B2B Revenue Executive Experience.

You're listening to the BB revenue executive experience, a podcast dedicated to helping executives train their sales and marketing teams to optimize growth. Whether you're looking for techniques and strategies or tools and resources, you've come to the right place. Let's accelerate your growth in three, two, one. Welcome everyone to the B Tob Revenue Executive Experience. I'm your host, Chad Sanderson. Today we're talking about brand saturation strategies. How do you lade your company on the first page of search results? Can these be applied to individuals and sales or marketers building a brand, and how might you be able to leverage reviews to drive that brand recognition? To help us, we have with US Chris Dicky, founder and seeo visibly, a company focused on aiding companies to manage their brand of visibility and search. Chris, thank you for taking the time and welcome to the show. Thanks for having me. Job All right. So, for those that are tuning in, I'll do going to give you a little bit of a heads up. We're using a new platform, Riverside DOT FM, that my production team at sweet fish media has convinced me. I know how to use and can be effective with. So any screw ups are not my fault. I'm just going to put that at sweet fish store give them, hopefully, an opportunity to step up and if not, you know, hey, don't, don't jump into new tech in the middle of a pandemic. So, Chris, before we get started, I always like to know now for our audience, you're in we were talking about this before started. You're in Jackson Haw Wyoming, which is probably one of the most beautiful places on the planet my opinion. So I think I might have an idea of what this hands will be. But always like to know something that you are passionate about outside of work that those who know you largely from work or from your digital brand may be surprised to learn. Yeah, well, lots of things I'm passionate about. You are probably corrected assuming that I enjoy the mountains. That's what we have here. We have really big ones. My favorite, my favorite place to be. What I'm on the office is, you know, is up in those mountains. I see I've skied actually most of the peaks. The tetons have also climbed most of the peaks in the Teaton so wow, summer, when it doesn't matter to me. Nice. The tetons are impressive effect. I have a picture of we wrote our motorcycle crew us went through a motorcycles and took pictures of from the teats. They're very jagged. I look very Jagga. So how the hell do you climb autom of them? They just well, it's just walk up them, you know, it's like ropes involved. But yeah, all right, all right, very cool. Yeah, I'm that's one thing I've never been, I think, comfortable enough to do is strap myself to ropes and climb a rock. I don't think it's because I think I'll fall. Yeah, I don't know, it's just it's one of those times. Have a rope. Yeah, maybe it's my natural skepticism about the quality of the only one rule to to a climbing and that is don't fall. Is To is to make sure that you know in case you break rule number one. But the only don't fall in love it. All right, perfect. So, all right, let's talk about building brand strategies, and this is has become, continues to evolve into a pretty complex topic, given the myriad of digital properties and outlets and avenues it's become more than just sitting around a room going hey, if our company was going to be a car, what kind of car would it be? I've sat back in the day, sat through those brand conversations. So for those that may not, you know, have a full understanding of the context of everything that goes into it. What should a company when they think about the brand strategy, what all goes into that? What should they be considering? Oh my God, we'll start with a big question like that. Yeah, you know, I think you know I've played roles in all different pieces of kind of bread brand strategy. I I think that there's a lot of energy put into the creative side of it and that is cheer point. What kind of car are we is a lot less strategy, or at least it's more challenging to do the distribution side of it. How do we actually reach a consumer? How do we get them to click? How do we get...

...that conversion? There is the I think, fortunately, that's that's where all of the technology is kind of going in the MARTEX space. Is How do we actually is solicit that stuff? But it's just less fun to work on then branding. Absolutely, but I think that's that is ultimately where you know where the rubber hits the road for every single brand is getting in front of the right customer. Okay, and so you hit on a really important topic, the least fun or less fun side of it. Right. So, back in the day, I can remember, because I've spent the first part of my career in marketing, I remember Seo. To say there's up pay in the butt was a little bit of an understatement, right. But now it seems like showing up first on those search result pages it's almost like black magic, right. It's almost there's so much that goes into it that I think for many people it's overwhelming. I know as an individual running a company it sometimes short circuits my brain. And so anyway you can provide some context of what goes on under the covers to generate those search rankings and what is it that the people have to be aware of in terms of how their prioritize, how they're listed, things that just they have to understand from a contextual standpoint. Yeah, so, you know, just just to kind of set the table here, we're talking about search engine marketing. The reason why I love search and the way, that reason, I'm involved in searches, because search delivers this incredibly the high quality customer over and over and over and over again. There's people, adults on average use Google three times a day. It's an incredibly central piece to our lives. We have incredibly predictable click behavior if we don't know where what we're looking for. So I like a couple of non branded searches or or informational searches. And so basically, if we're open to suggestion, we're looking for something, you basically have the top half of the screen to capture your customer and there's a ton of them there and they're all highly qualified. They're all looking for exactly the practice service you have to to provide because they already ask that question right. So that's why just to so that's why search is so unique and so special for marketers. But to your point, Chad, it's incredibly challenging to be at the top of the half of that screen. You can buy your way on to that page and advertising a high performing ad or just a well performing ad and the top of search for a non branded search query. Those around two percent of the traffic on the page. That means ninety eight percent of those customers or finding their answers somewhere else. So you sure you can be there? You can pay the nose to be there. Every people do because they have to. But really we're all the we're all the traffic goes up to twenty to thirty percent of that traffic is on that first organic link. In this first five organic links receive almost seventy percent of all the traffic. So you really need to be right there. And for companies that are able to deploy Seo Strategies that get them there, fantastic. Mean Amazons one of them, you know, and Nikes one of them. They are so dominant, they're so Olympic podium level it's almost it's almost impossible to knock them up. I mean almost impossible, like if, which is called impossible, and that is because, you know, Google looks at a lot of different things, not just google but other search engines as well. But then one of the biggest ones is is how many in bound links you have coming into your say, and it's called in the Seo community backlinks. There's all the different kinds of backlinks, but fundamentally there's just it's a it's a kind of a game of like social strategy. Like all these other sites. Think you're important. Google recognizes that, then they elevate you. Do you really think you're going to get more backlinks than than Amazon? That's a good question. Probably not be amazing if you can pull that off, though. Yeah. Yeah, so this is why I think it's worth thinking about other strategies outside of advertising and outside of Seo for the rest of us that need to attract and retrustomers and that on...

...that very limited real estate. Yeah, and so that. You said something really interesting, that the the top five, I don't remember the exact a top five organic results get seventy some percent of the traffic or something. Interestingly enough, when I mean I'm I'm probably one of those adults that excuse the excuse the stats because I'm using Google all the time throughout the day. But I also noticed that an interesting habit. I just became aware that I was actually doing it a couple weeks ago and if I search for something, my searches are typically pretty specific and when it comes up there's usually that first ad or there's two ads of the top and I never click on them. I never click on the ads. I always scroll down and to the to the ones blow and nine times out of ten, eight times out of ten, that person who paid for that ad is also the first organic result. And I know if I click on that ad then there's cost involved in still this certainly a strategy to be had that you so as an advertiser, you don't pay for the ad and less someone clicks on it. And so sometimes people will say, well, it's worth just being there because we're reinforcing the brand got, because I sees those top positions, and so even if we're not getting the click, will people to know that we exist and that's that's a legitimate strategy. Yep, okay, all right. And so when we're not, when we're, we're trying to find the realize we're not going to be Damazon and the and we the tissues are dried out and everybody understands we're not going to be D Amazon at this game. In there yet is there? You know, the reviews. We're hearing a lot about review sites and reviews and things like that. Third Party site. So how do they play it to the equation and and are there are some that are more critical than others? Yeah, well, not really. I mean it like I think it really is very bespoke to every single category or an industry or subject that you're looking for, because there are a specialist in these subjects, right, and Google recognizes their their authority and then they reward them. The challenge is monitoring it on a large, and I'm not you know, on a large basis, because there's so many iterations of keywords and how someone might type in a question and you switch the name around a few times and then all of a sudden you get a different search result. And also you get a different search result if you're on a mobile device or dust stop, because they assume things about your behavior if you're on your mobile device. So you know each one of these places or you're going to literally see different things. And what's what's interesting is the consumer journey is just never as linear as as we wish it was. Right, like you don't, people don't just see something and they're like, I'm gonna buy that, and then the right right through and they buy it. It's more like, oh, like I had this question, like maybe I'm looking to get some new granite countertops or something new, and I like, I'm going to look and look up and see a question between how does courts compared to grant it? And that's and that that kind of like very top of the funnel. Search is going to start someone's buying journey. They don't even know what kind of product they want, but they know they need a new countertop. Right. So they start and learning about the countertop. At that point it's it's imperative that brands reached them there. Start right as they start to think about it. Yeah, yeah, and then the next question is then they might go a little further down the funnel and there, okay, I actually really want a courts to countertop. Where would I buy a quartz countertop? And now you have another set of you know, result show up. These are much more transactional and nature people who are selling courts kind of tops are than teaching about them. You still want to be there and then that's so this is these are all the kind of stages and that buying journey and they each one of them plays out in search and I think each one of them is an incredibly important place for a brand to reach. And the more reinforcement you have along that bindjuring, the more likely you are to win the sale. Right, absolutely, this is something that it's not just me coming up with this. Amazoner, not Amazon. Hub Spot, wrote a whole blog speries about this last year. They call it the surround sound strategy and effectively, buying a crm is a big purchase and...

...they know that there's a lot of competition out there. They know that their website well, housepot riggs really, really well in search. There's still nine or ten other options on the page where you will look at right. So what they realize is that they need to be in as many as many of those search results as they possibly can be. And because there's all these listicles and there's all these round ups about the best rm's, they need to be everywhere someone looks across a very large swath the keywords for them to maintain their market position. And so they deployed the same strategy. They call it surround sound and the ideas is that like, you can't avoid him, you're getting you're getting showered with hub spot everywhere you're looking for a crm, and it's a very deliberate strategy that they deploy that basically takes their brand presence beyond their own website, beyond their own advertising, and is leveraging these third parties to make sure that they are very dominant, interesting and so I mean it's a level of complexity to first you have to understand the customer journey right. That first the first time somebody will just go with the countertop through the first time somebody thinks to I want quarts or do I work granted, and it business. It's the same thing. People don't search necessarily for the solution, they search for the information. Right we see them. We see them doing the searches and doing the research to kind of fuel the thought process, so to speak. That's that could be a really ethereal part of the revenue funnel. It could be very difficult to know. You know, what are they going to be searching for because if you think about it from a business standpoint, you're so close to your own solution. You know how you'd search for it, but that isn't necessarily how your customer or potential customer is going to search for it. Other strategies and ways that people can think in advance or kind of get outside of their own own tree house to see the forest, so to speak. I think I screwed that one up really bad. That analogy but you know what I mean. How do I set that bag? I step back. Yes, so you know the problem with search is that it's a multi channel playground in a lot of different pieces of any marking department are going to be responsible for various performance at you know, attributes and search. But unfortunately I marking departments they're so silod people work in their silos and they don't care about how the other teams are doing. But you cannot approach search in that way. If you want to be dominant, if you want to be ubiquitous, your teams have to get aligned and so you have to realize that you have to be on those those ecommerce product pages that are that are surfacing, and how do your ECOMMERCE teams optimize for those product pages are search surfacing? Your PR teams have to be reaching the bloggers that are driving that that top of funal awareness. So when you're saying courts versus versus granite, that's going to be an informational keyword right like people aren't looking to buy at that point, they're looking to learn and that plays really well into the PR team's. Pr Teams, I guarantee, aren't thinking about this, but if they knew that this was a that that this was important and they knew that these people were driving a ton of customer consideration, then they could do it. So that's that's part of it and so, you know, I guess the tied into kind of what I do is I actually come from a PR background. I own a PR agency. We started realizing years ago that our most performant PR hits weren't the ones that were in the most most most prestigious publications, they were the ones that were showing up at the top of search and they were driving the most traffic and the most affiliate, you know, revenue, and so on and so forth, and we just asked ourselves the question, how do we do more of this? And it let us down this rabbit hole of really understanding how the consumer journey plays out in search and about how there's so many more responsibilities than just the SEO team. For interesting...

...and it's I mean it's a complex web search right. It's a complex web. You've got even even just one topic, as that should sound to many, and unless it makes them cringe and freak out like it does me, think about the search results in the Seo like that just seems overwhelming, but there's so many silos that play in especially from a business standpoint. Now, when we've talked about doing this, I'm you set ups, but calls it to surround sound strategy or the I think when we were talking at one point, it's about managing more real estate, so to speak. Right. Yeah, so I'm always curious. There are their places. That shows up in search, but I'm curious how, like sites like Cora and others, are review sites play into that as well? Are they in this mathematical morass that is behind the scenes? Are they somehow weighted heavier, or do they have the more impact because it is other potential customers providing insights? Is there something that's somehow gives that a little bit more weight because it's less biased than what maybe marketing from the source may seem like? We're maybe perceived to be good question. What I can tell you is, you know what what we've done at at visibly, the software company that I work at, we've basically mapped out in a high degree of granularity where people click on the page and this is where they click when there's not an intention of where to go. So what what you know? What you know what it is not a navigational search. And so if they're open to whatever they're they're like, they're open to learning and they and they have no agenda. And this is this is, on average, where everyone's going to click. And so what we know is how many, how frequently, people click on. People also ask, and that's a lot of times where Cora shows up. And we also know the frequency of how times people click on on on local packs, which is like the maps that you see when you're in trying to go someplace. And so we have this good, really good data on where people are navigating and and what their click behavior looks like in search. And so I would say that in general, people navigate toward the organic links those. That is just I think that's a something that's wired from the early days of the Internet. This is that these are the most important things on the page. I don't know, but they they solicit the most clicks by a long shot, unless it's like a map or something like that, and then which case those maps do really, really well. And then there's a lot of what you call searches that are called called no click searches, and there are people who are looking for an answer that does not require them to click on anything, and Google is trying to optimize for these searches. They they're like answer boxes and knowledge panels and things like that. So if Google can try to answer your question without solicting at Click, it's a better user experience for you and it's better for a Google because it means that you never leave their platform. But yeah, we don't think their money off ads. So if I'm not if they're answering the question, that I don't go anywhere else. Well, it's all about becoming central to your life really, and so the more useful Google can be come to you that that means that you'll just keep coming back to it. So the fact that there's three, you know, on every adults checking Google three times a day, that's exactly where they want us. They got it. They got US exactly where they was. Have you seen the I know Google not necessarily Social Lema, but have you seen the social dilemma? Have you seen the movie the Social Dilemma? And I have. Yeah, well, man, talk about freaking me out, Teddy, I actually divested of all my facebook holdings after that movie. Did you really? I can understand why. I can understand why. I mean it's really there was a book, I canmem if we was mentioned in the in the movie or not, called the surveillance economy. That where we've basically become the product. That that takes that social dilemma to a whole other level. So if you were, if anybody listening, a hundred percent sure, I mean everyone listen to this knows it. Like, if you're not paying for it, you go that's because you are the product. Yeah, and you have to be okay that. I no, I remember time. We're totally off track here,...

...but hey, that's what happens. So I remember back in the day when I was working for and running sales and marketing teams for digital agencies, we had to put a great deal of effort to convince the people that we were building these experiences for to allow the location to be scraped so they knew, so I could provide location based date. At now maybe up dating myself, but we're going back some fifteen years when we started this and there were people who said there is no way anybody will ever ever let you know where they are through their phone. And now, fast forward, people get pissed if I pull up some vice ask something and something doesn't give me like an answer. Where's the closest pizza joint to where I'm standing? Then then they're irritated because it hits that user experience thing. They'll go someplace. I think there's a genuine usefulness, you know, honestly, like yes, we're trying to sell you stuff, but you know, Google has provided a genuinely useful set of tools and they still have to make money off those tools. So they can't do they have to sell access to you. But like, you know, same thing with all this stuff. You know, and I think that's the marketers dilemma is, how do you be useful, not obnoxious and and ultimately, marketers that can be useful like, for instance, and there were way off topic, but people who are getting emails in their inbox, like if you're getting an email from, say, your favorite when your favorite clothing companies, and they know your clothing size and they know that you look in and there's a hey, there's a sale on these things today. We thought you be interested. Oh cool, I appreciate that, you know, but if it's like not targeted, it has nothing to do with you, and you're like leave me alone, so, yeah, absolutely. Well, now I'm starting to get random texts, random text that are trying to market to me things that are not safe for work to talk about, and I don't know why I'm getting those, but I they show up on my phone all the time, really invasive and annoying, and there's no ide how I'm clicking on a link from somebody I don't know. I'm smart enough to know I could cause some seriously bad things happened to that right, all right, so let's see if I could bring us back. So let's talk about visibly for a second. How did we end up with this solution, with this company right where? What tell us about the journey? How do we get to see you don't founder visibly? Yeah, so the journey really came from I'm a pure professional or what? You know what we do all day long, as we leverage third party endorsements on behalf of our clients and we get other people to talk about our stuff. That's what we do, that's what the PR does. It was it was a natural progression to see search in the same way. What's lowers other people to talk about our stuff. Let's let's these guys are showing up with the first page of search. Let's get them to talk about our brand, because we can't get there. That's a that's a natural thing for a PR person I think about apparently no one else in the world thinks about that. So you know, as you were, as you're kind of going down this this path with that, you know what the agency we realize that there were no tools to measure what we were doing. And and I had a very simple question at the time, and the question was, and I'm a brand, where do I exist in search? And nobody could answer that question. They could say, I'll tell you what your website exists, I'll tell you what your ads exist, but I can't tell you what your brand exists because that requires third party measurement and that doesn't there's no there's no kind of solution intact for that. And so after I kind of realize that was truly not existent in the marketplace, I figured we have to we someone has to do it. So that's that's where I kind of jumped from pr into software and I said, okay, let's let's build a software platform that basically is a brand of listening software for search engines. And how can we how can we unpack the customer journey, unpack how brands are reaching customers and deliver kind of valuable insights around that. Awesome and it's are we still run in the PR agency to? Oh Yeah, yeah, I...

...love it all right. So, if there were two things you want listeners to start doing tomorrow to help with the search results, what are what would it be? What would be that, if the two things you boiled down to just do things? Yeah, I'd say that. You know, the first thing, guys, is work with your work with your teammates and cross functional teams. You know, it's a search is not just an SEO game. It's a PR game, it's an ECOMMERCE game, it's an SEM game. All these teams need to like get around a table and figure out how to work together. Awesome. Number two is you really need to identify search intent, and this is something we haven't talked about today, but search intent is the idea that that Google has to make a determination about what. What do we want to see when we type in a keyword? Do we want to buy something, do we want to click, do we want to go somewhere, or do we want to learn about something? And once you unpack search intent. It really opens up this incredible strategic playground that all these teams can kind of contribute to because, like I said earlier about the quartz countertops, it's like, okay, someone's looking at courts verstagranic counter tops. That's a purely informational search intent and you have to deploy PR strategies to get there. Maybe Seo Strategies, but mostly be our strategies. Further down the funnel, someone's looking to buy a grand a countertop. That's a totally different deployment of strategies. That's much more on it on on the on the SEO and also on the on the growth kind of commerce side. So you want to make sure that your well position John, you know, with like home de bill or lows or something. But anyways, those those are the two pieces that team seem to kind of work together on. I love it and it's a great reason for people to reach out to die further into that search intent conversation with you and with your organization, because that's a whole another level old level, another level of complexity. So let's change direction a little bit. We ask all of our guests to standard questions the end of each inne first is as a CEO and founder. That makes you a target or a prospect for many, many people who are trying to sell stuff, and I'm always really curious to know, in this world we live in where everybody is inundated in digital and we have more distractions than we can count, when somebody doesn't have a trusted referral into you, somebody that you know where, that you've had some type of relationship in the past, just cold. It's totally cold. What works for you when somebody's trying to capture your attention and earn the right to time on your calendar? Yeah, I'd say there's a certain amount of luck, no question. That is the first time I have heready. They have to know that I need something and I haven't told them any. You need it yet, you know. So there's there's that, and then I'd say number two is just a personalization and understanding kind of who I am, what my pain points are, and so we're most of those services that were that we're acquiring right now. We're on boarding a pretty high touch and we're for instance, just the other day we had a hunt under reach out to us. That was good, as hey would like to headhunt some people for you. I'm like, you know what, it's actually good timing because we're looking higher. But they that was lost. It also done there. They'd also done research on who we were and like our market sector and they were experts in it. And they also said, okay, here are three candidates that I think you would you would be interested at talking to and here's who they are. And they followed up with the phone call and and I was like this all resonates, this is perfect, like you save me a bunch of time. Thank you. So I love it. Well, saving time, understanding your audience. Right, there's always that aspect, aspect of luck, but I think if you can really understand who it is you're reaching out to and stop automated, it is pro marketing is huge and coming from a PRC background, it's all we deal all day long is cold outreach, a lot of it. But you, your your list will be much better if you if you just spend the time make sure that you're reaching the person...

...actually wants to hear the message. You have to say. Yeah, I love it, I love it all right, last question. We call it our acceleration and say you had one. Now I give you two before, but now we're going to just brought it out. Say, in marketing, sales pr one piece of advice that, if somebody listen to you, actually believe would help them hit or exceed their targets. What would it be and why? Man, I would I would just say, you know, get focused on distribution. You know, put your operations ahead of your marketing. You know, make sure that your product is dialed, make sure that you have something that is is well packaged and then focus on reaching the right people. I think that I see it all the time as an agency person that people put the marketing ahead of the product and I think that's always a recipe for disaster. Love it excellent. Well, Chris. I can't thank you enough for being on the show day. If a listeners interested in talking more about these topics. Going into that search and tent, which anybody listening, I highly recommend you really dive into what that means, because it is crazy. Where do you want us to send them? Do you want US website linked? It will smokes, it will check out, check out visibly. It's vis ablycom we have a free, free tool up there. No the credit card anything that thing like that required, because check it out and I'm at I'm on Linkedin, so it's a great place to reach me. Just Chris underscored, Dicky DIIC K E why and you'll see me a CEO of that at a visibly awesome and I really appreciate you taking the time. Glad we were able to connect and do this today. All right. Well, thank you. Chat all right, everybody that does it for this episode. You know the drill. CHECK US out. A be to be read exactcom sure with friends, family, Co workers. Let your kids listen to it or watch it. So I'm not sure if we're going to use this video. It's you know, it's screen time, but hey, you got two goodlooking dudes that they should you know. We're taking the Ganderra at and make sure that they're listening to the message. Until next time, we have value something associates with you all nothing but the greatest success. You've been listening to the BB revenue executive experience. To ensure that you never miss an episode, subscribe to the show and Itunes or your favorite podcast player. Thank you so much for listening. Until next time,.

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