The B2B Revenue Executive Experience
The B2B Revenue Executive Experience

Episode · 9 months ago

Why Authenticity Is the Key to Personalization at Scale w/ Nick Casale


Personalization is one of the most effective tools for any seller.

Yet, scaling it often proves an enormous challenge. Why is that?

Because without authenticity, personalization is meaningless.

To find out why, I turned to the expert on personalization, Nick Casale, Director of Sales at Sendoso, a selling platform facilitating sending just about anything you could imagine to your prospects, customers, or employees.

In this episode, we discuss:

  • How Sendoso helps sellers personalize at scale
  • Why authenticity is the key to personalization at scale
  • How the pandemic underscores the importance of a personal touch

This post includes highlights of our podcast interview with Nick Casale, Director of Sales at Sendoso.

For the entire interview, you can listen to The B2B Revenue Executive Experience.

If you don’t use Apple Podcasts, we suggest this link.

The so many platforms you can use nowto sort of pseudo personalize its scale, what I really break it down to now nwhat we challenge our my team and our customers to do is to think aboutauthenticity and doing that at a reasonable scale. You're listening to the DTB revenueexecutive experience, a podcast, dedicated helpan executives, traintheir sales and marketing teams to optimize growth, whether you're lookingfor techniques and strategies were tools and resources. YOUV come to theright place. Let's accelerate your growth in three to one. Welcome e!! youone to the B to b revenue executive experience. I'm your host ChadSanderson today we're talking about how a more effectively engaged prospects,how to drive personalization it scale and I'm not going to miss theopportunity Ta such on. Why startup founders need to understand sales, aswe all know, that's a hot button topic for me to help us. We have with thisNick Casal director of sales, an Sandoso iy. Thank you so much forTakeng time and welcome to the show Jad. Thank you for having me. So we a wayslike to start with jus the lifebreaker, and it's just an opportunity find forthe audience to get to know you a little bit of better as a person kindof been on this kick lately. I don't know why I've just understandingsomething that our guests are passionate about, that our listenersmight be surprised to learn yeah absolutely so one thing I've beeninvolved in for the past couple o years. That I'm really passionate about issomething called the Canon Project which was started by a friend of mineand the sort of larger mission of helping students, while they're stillin university. Understand that startups and specifically start up sales is aqueer path. It might sound silly, but no one stops to tap you on the shouldersophomore junior year college and tell you that you can go to a company you'venever heard of in San Francisco O wherever it might be, and you know, gobuild something special thos thise companies, just don't make it to tocampus, is to recruit thet, O the resources, and so a lot of friends ofmine have gone into more traditional career paths. You know consultingfinance and then pivoted later to startups once they found out. That wasan option. So I love you know: Working with Milea Moter, Boston, College,hosting college students coming out to San Francisco, showing them around theoffice and setting them up with o other startups to really open their eyes tothis wonderful world of starts well, an it's, it's exposing them to things theywouldn't have known. Were there like. I said they don't come to campus andthere's so many alum out there startups. If you know, if you know where to look,but at that age they probably don't, and then I'm curious, though, when youget involved with them to any of them, maybe at that age they don't they'renot as concerned about. I any of them worry about start up risk when you'retalking with the youngens they do yeah and it's something where I sort ofchallenge them to ask yourself. You know what is the worst case scenariohere and I think for most people, your appetite for riskshould be the highest year, one out of college and probably go down from thereright. You know you're not going to have youdon't have kids, you don't have a mortgage, probably macsom student loans,the topics something to consider, but there is a little bit of that. You knowhey if you're goingno throw the deepball the time to do it right,absolutely so al right. So, let's start with just for context for the audiencejust an overview of kind of brief oeview of what Sandoso does so thatwe've got some context for our conversation. Yeah absolutely soSindosa is a setting platform. So we basically falcilled tape the process ofsending just about anything to your prospects, customers, employees. Sothat could be. You know: Five Dollar Starbok Gift Card, a Brandon, Patagoniaor we've been integre with Amazon. So you can speak a mild moter. Someonecould go on there, be our inagration, send me a Boston College, Mug, andactually, just yesterday we announced that we released a cameo integration,so you can send someone a video or...

...snoop dog pitching im your product orwhatever. That might be. I'm really excited about that one. Has Anybodydone t at yet com that can because cameo thing I thinks relatively new interms of scaling it, but have you 've obviously tested it? I would assume sodive into that a little bit, because that is that's extremely interestingyeah. So you know we actually borrowd this idea from the people over a gonsuper creative SCR and sales organization and they realized and kindof getting creative and getting taxtical that there was this reallycool platform called Canya. Where you could. You know hired anyone from likeRobert Herzevek to snoop dog to the guy. Who does the dress comas from SiliconValley if Youve seen that show and they'll basically say whatever youwhanever, you kind of put in the comments and it ends up being. You knowreally funny and and definitely stands out and is numberable, and so they weregoing on a cameo and spending all this money and setting people stuff. But youknow you're having to go over the platform you're having a copypace links,see if they opened it, it's disjoin it it's own. You got to expense it afterthe fact and there's no tracking on it, and that's really why people use inDoso for anything right and that's what I love to tell people is, you know heyif you're not sure this stuff works, you know, don't don't take it for me,don't buy Syndo, so you got go test this on your Ron and you're, going tofigure out two things, one that it works and to that it's a pai in the putthit you don' have tha platform Toffacilitativ and so youv got a lot ofplaces. You have to go exactly so. You H to answer your question. You know wealmost everything we built is is an idea. We borrow from our customer stuff,they've, seen work and we integrate into the platform and try to streamlineit for him, and so obviously your team, you know your sales team is using. Iwould assume the platform and using this in their prospecting, efforts.personalization, it scale is a huge challenge for a lot of organizations,and so I'm curious to dive a little bit into how your teams leveraging TNATonly your own tools or maybe you're, guiding them to optimize theirprospecting motion and and deal with that personalization at Scallechallenge. Yeah, really glad you brought this point up, it's funny. Iactually talked to Jeremy Donnoven over it sells last about this a couple weeksago and we were sort of bowing it down to is the personalization it scale hasbecome. I think really tired in a lot of ways and I'm sure you've received alot of correspondence that is sort of inlignment that personalization atscale model where it's you know a first name notice, blank whatever it might bewherether it's sort of just those data inputs and there's so many platforms.You can use now to sort of pseudo personalizeits scale what I reallybreak it down to now. What we challenge our my team and ourcustomers to do isto think about authenticity and doing that at areasonable scale. Right you, don't you don't want to sacrifice the qualitythere for the quantity of course, but how do you go beyond personalization totry to actually make an authentic connection? That's a big! So I'm justI'm processing that for a second. So that's a big, so the question becomes:How do you do that and still maintain the level of activity necessary to fillthe pipe plane or achief whatever objectives the organization is sent yeah well and I'll. Tell you. I think, if you think about it this way, ifyou're firing off ten emails to a friend, you can getthat done incredibly quickly because you're not as worried, maybe about things like word choice or where youcapitalize or even small things like grammar. I don't, I think it Cantrar inhere. I think, the more that you are yourself and communicate from thatplace of Autenticity, the more that the recipient is going to see you as being authentic and being sort of areal human being and a real person with with you know your own personalityyouon flavor and the message is just going... come across more of thantic and it'sgoing to naturally feel more personalized because marketing, letmarketing do their thing right. Markeng of ther emails, yeah you're, not you're,not a Marquetto, yemail blast right, so you know why why be focused onhyperscale? You know hyperpolished personalized, that's, and I thinkpeople also talk a lot about this and is it's on Robin hold we can get downto, but with obviously ai and all the technology. THAT'S GOINGNO! That'salready innovated a time and wi'll continue to. Where does the human fitwithin all this right, because there is there's, probably a tool, that's lessthan twelve months away where you could plug t into your sale sporce and it cansend a Pirs lize Yoknai that everyone multistap whatever. So, where does thehuman come into play here? And what can we do? Thet machines can't- and I thinkthat's the authenticic piece and that's what I'm excited about yeah and itmakes sense I mean because the Automationis not hard to pick up, Imean even as the tech ivolves it still. I haven't seen anything that I haven'tbeen able to look at and go either. This was a template out of out ofsomething like SOS of Tor outreach that just dropped in some key. You knowphrases my name or name of the company or whatever I haven't seen anythingthat has the ability to get to that anywhere near that authentic level, butbeing authentic in communication and outreacs. There's a skill set to that.That's really more on the human side. So when you're looking for hiring orcoaching sales individuals, what types of behaviors and skills are you looking for ways? Areyou w testing their ability to be authentic in their communications? Yeah? It's a really great point. Ithink selfawareness is hat the. Is it the heart of it all in terms ofunderstanding. You know, if you tell someone hey just be authentic with it dod they have a you know what I mean.They know what that Beins yeah does that land and what is their authenticpersonality right, and I don't necessarily care I'm not looking for aspecific profile of authenticity and in fact, it's incredibly important to meto have a diverse team where everyone has their own flavor of that, like ifyou're someone who uses really you know, colorful language is really expressivein a motive. Go lead with that. If you're someone I mean, we have an SDRone of our best Dan in David Denver shout out David he's awesome and he isthe most high energy guy that you'll ever meet and he's gifts and calfsletters and that's who he is in slack Thato. He is an internal emails and welove seeing him be like that with prospects of customers, because you getthose emails and it just jumps out of your inbox because it doesn't look likethe nine other templatuve things you have it's so much emotion, oftantissy that youjust can't help but feel that right it comes through. It translates yeah andhave you seen so that kind of authenticity combined with usingSyndoso? Can you paint kind of a picture of how your teams are kind ofcombining that for a campaign based or cadencs, based or sequence base,whatever we're doing to use outreach approach? Yeah? Absolutely so I thinkagain, you know I'm going to be a dead horse here, but it goes back to beingauthentic and leveraging sendo. So as just another channel, and I think theauthenticity should carry through all channels you use and the obvious oneswere, people are phone and email right. So that's what we just talked aboutwith email- I think ha fholme piece is pretty straightforward, don't be arobout when you call someone and then with Andos. All we're doing is enablinga new channel for people so hey look, you can send an email, you can make aphone call. You can also send stuff to and that's what we open up the doors tois. You know you can send someone branded golf teas from their Alma moder.If you find out their Golfer, you can...

...send them. You know a lunch gift card.If you know they're going to have a busy day, ind their back toback or, ifthey're doing your favor and taking the meeting you have during what you knowtheir lunch houer right. So it's really just this sort of pandors box ofoptions for making that shouming connection, and especially now you knowI can't empatize thiis enough with. I know I am feeling th the burn out andthe effect of not being able to get on a plane and go meet with my prospectsand customers and every. I think everyone is sort of hurting as a resultof that right. There's no conferences! There's no trade chow, there's nohandshake with the prospect, no matter how big the deal is, and so how do youtry to replace that just a little bit and have you seen big changes? I mean.Obviously you know the pandemic changed everything for a lot of people changesin kind of people's response when they receive something or I could bepotentially increased challenge of finding out where to send them stuff,because a lot of people are at their offices are at home. Have you run into any of that and if so,have you dealt with it? Yeah so I'll give you sort of twoanswers. The first is from a little bit more of just the logistics of actuallysending items, so we throw our platform. Let you prompt an email to someone or alittle link you can put in your own email and that'll just say: Hey, I'msetding you over something. Let me know what I address to send it to, and youknow we're tack to compliant that Datas never stored. In fact, our clientscannot see the address that their prospects put in, even if they wantedto it's all completely secure okaybut that gives that that sort of power ofchoice and flexibility, so someone can sort of both oft into receiving theitem and put in the preferred address. That's obviously you know invaluableright now and then the other piece of it is, I think, leading with empathy issomething that we've seen be incredibly powerful the past couple months, and sothat's Arisein things like charity donations, it's a risein recognizingpeople's reality. And again all this is sort of. I think, once you have e theright to leverage this information but say you're on a zoom call with someoneand they've got. You know kids jumping up in the background or this dogbarking starting to recognize their reality, and appreciating that peopleare inviting you into their homes now, and I think Thare's a responsibility asa seller to recognize that to appreciate it and to be real about the fact that things aredifferent and you're selling to you know a person, that's dealing withunique challenges and an unique reality right now, and so how can you try tomake that connection by recognizing those things yeah? It is a highlyemotionally charged environment right now, and you have to be really carefulabout understanding that everybody's experiencing it differently. Some,maybe some you know like myself- have had probably losses from the pandemic.Others have maybe haven't been directly touched other than he the lockdown, butare still in an environment where they're isolated. It creates a drasticincrease for the need for empathy. Have you found a way? I have notsuccessfully found a way to teach it to teach empathy to help someone slow downenough to understand. You are dealing with a human being, I'm curious whenyou're, hiring or you're coaching your teams, how you might reinforce thatwith them, because they themselves are also going through this, and so how doyou? How do you kind of bridge that gap and kind of level level set the field?I think it's all about the tone that you set and the entire leadership teamin sets, and I think it's coming from a place of a trust that the people thatyou hire to do a job are doing the job, but also not being toned up in thosemoments right and a few of the I'll...

...give you an example. You know we'd abuyer a couple weeks ago they missed a meeting, and so you know the reds sortof trying to explain trying to figure out what happened as a manager. Youcould say: Look we had this on the meet on the calendar. t the Keyvl, you knowis a kyddeal for your quarter. You know, did you set the gendird? You do all thethings you do, Ang you can sort of come down them or you can take a step backand say: Let's assume that you did do all all the things right. There couldbe something else going on, and you said that tone of let's just sort ofseek to understand here and we come to find out. The person ended up havingchild care for the evening fall through right, and so I think that as long asyour employees and Simon sneck talks a ton about this- and I think he's abrilliant Blin author and thought we wer here, his Ted tolks are great. Hisbooks are great leaders, e lausts, a favorite of mine. When your employeesfeel safe, they will do their best work, yeah, absolutely absolutely and so havehave. You had challenges like how is just hav curiosity, how has sindosofound business changing for them in the middle of this, whereas we go throughthis kind of new situation, an the pandemic and stuff? What changes haveyou had to make across the organization? Aside from you mentioned, not traveling,but m curious. What other ways of you proactively tackle it to ensure thatthe employees feel safe and continue the hopefully the growth cojectory?Again, it's a really good point, and I would say honestly that it's somethingthat we're still figuring out. It is 't wortits, workin progress, yeah, it's acomplete workin progress and I think it it requires, starting at at a point of we don't knowhow to do this and that that sort of against selfawareness and therecognition that there's not a playbook for this and we're going to figure outas we go and being up front with the employees on that too. Right, because one of the most frustarting things iswhen leadership I think, pretends that everything is figured out and e. Thereis a playbook Er. There is a system, and I think that can really deteriorate.Trust were, on the other hand, sort of just opening your arms and saying tothe team or to employees we're going to AL figure this out together, and wedon't know- and we need to hear from you what you need and we'll do our bestto support that. But this is going to be a conversation. It's not going to bea series of orders. Absolutely it has to be collaborative. I think I've seenI mean as much as we're all you know, dealing with the Zoomtik yeah, theorganizations that that enable that collaboration that rely on and listento their employees. I think, have a tendency to weather much better thanthose that kind of have that fear base reaction, where they clamp down, at least from at least from what I'veseen so far, so 'm glad to hear that that's kind of the approach thatsyndoswas taken so any stats that you might have or insight into kind of howeffective things were: Pre covid versus how your teams are doing today in termsof leveraging those multiple channels always like to see. If there's you knowthings that you've seein your trends that you're seeing as things arechanging and envolving ol absolutely, and it's been interesting to just seethe shift in how our customers think about metrics and the things that areimportant to them. And so you know, of course it's something where pre covidwe're talking about. Increasing OSPONSOIHT's, right and we'Ltl tell youknow, talk to clients and Whell, say: Hey we're getting you know four timesbetter responsored than we're getting before, or our emails are getting twopercent engagement. Rade were Sineing Finheen, an twenty with Sindoso rightand we're still seeing metric sort of inline with that really strong in termsof the engagement piece, if you send someone an offer to to send themsomething they'll confirm their address. theire sixty five percent of the time,which is thenominal and really gives... opportunity to make sure you'rebeing conscious about spend right now because of course, precovid. If you'resending something to an office there'salways a chance, tot gets lostright and now we're saying: Let's get the addressfrom the recipient, so you're Makei, Thir, sort of a double opton going onthere, where they're saying sure I'll receive something, that's engageintitself and then when they receive something, is that second tear ofengagement. The part that I think sort of one layer deeper is that's reallyinteresting right now what the people we talk to is back to trade shows beingcanceled. That was a really coore piece of theway that most marketing teams were getting their leads pipeline, their youknow metrics for the year and that's how they were hitting goals. And so wetalk these marketers all day and I think together, we're sort of figuringout that you can't just go, spend more on Marquetto and get more out of itright. There's, there's sort of an absolute limit to the amount that youcan spend until, and I give the analogy of you think about digital channelsright, like let's just use, email or ads, for example, and obviously we'reall inindated with all of these things, but it's a congested highway thatsuddenly has more cars trying to get onto it all of a sudden, because it'sthe only option yeah, I saw stat somewhere just regular email like openrates. Pre covid globally were around thirty to thirty six percent globallyand then, when covid hit, I saw stats that it had dropped into like sixpercent, because I mean just think about. I haven't run the analysis on myowningbox, but I can tell you that the email exploded once you stopped allgetting on planes and stuff. Think about that, the inundation of sortingyou have to do that going through stuff what it takes to get somebody'sattention. I, like the double opten t that also get you around privacyconcerns. I would assume we considering. We've got what is it the CaliforniaConsumer Privacy Protection I, which is a lovely piece of legislation that hasbig risks for organizations so to set that up and be able to provide that toorganizations I think, is a definite win, especially when we're in an everevolving business environment. So well done want to change direction here, alittle bit. We ask all of our guests kind of two standard questions at theend of each interview. The first is simply as a sales leader that probablymakes you a prospect for other people. So there's probably people trying toget in front of you and get your attention always curious to understandwhat works best. If somebody doesn't have a referral like they don't know,somebody that you know and son somebody o trust what works best for you forthem to capture your attention and earn time to earn the right time hen yourcalendar. This is a softball come on. Well, I know I know I hope I hope youare consistent in your answers because I have I have a bat but yeah. I want tohear I one here to Gei for the guests, of course. So Hey I'm, always I'mobviously going to say you know, try to send me something get myattention and if that's not something that you had the resources to do againbe authentic right, be yourself and the differenceis is so obvious on thereceiving end, when you're getting a tempeater email, someone else wroteversus someone really trying to be themself in theire and their messagingand hiy. Think for me, that makes all the difference absolutely agree. Onehundred percent- all right so now LE'm going to alter our last question alittle bit, because I know what I would say if I were Ou, so I'm going tochange it up just a little bit. We call it our acceleration insight. If therewas one thing you could tell sales marketing or professional servicespeople aside from being authentic. One thing you could tell them tha side ofbeing on thonthing that you believe it they listened to. Oul would change thecourse of them hitting their targets. What would it be? And why so? My numberone piece of advice would be I'LL: go O a little bit of a different directionhere. Althous authentic city is the dramas I've been beating this. Thiswhole podcast here but I'll say,... to understand, write that on asticky note and put it on your desk and every time someone give you an answer,or you feel yourself, maybe going through the motions on a call reallychallenge yourself to seek to understand. Where that answers. Comingfrom what someone's dealing with the position, the organization might be inso many things right start to try to really fill in that portrait of what isthis person dealing with? What are the peripherals? What are they really? Howcan I help here? What are they trying to get out of this and really challengeyourself? Not to get your discovery, questions answered or to meet yourobjective, but to really understand absolutely love it all right, nick, ifa listners interested in more information on Sendoso or connectingwith you, where do you prefer we send them? You have a preferred outlot forus sendoscom. You can hit us up on link in. I am Nick ax anocom. If you want toflood by Handbox, we ere we're pretty easy get in touchwith all right Nik. I can't think younough for taking time it's been anabsolute pleasure to have you on the show. Chatter really appreciate, thanksfor taking the time all right, everybody that does ot this episode.You know the drill be to be revezactcom Shar with friends, family coworkers.Let the kids listen to it, it's better for him than screen time until nexttime we will talk. We wish nothing, but the greatest success you've been listening to the btobrevenue executive experience to ensure that you never miss an episodesubscribe to the show in Itunes or your favorite podcast player. Thank you somuch for listening until next time.

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