The B2B Revenue Executive Experience
The B2B Revenue Executive Experience

Episode · 4 years ago

Brian Turner on Why Revenue Should Be Used as a Trailing (Although Critical) Indicator of Business Health

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

“Revenue should not be your leading indicator.”

Come again?

That’s the claim made by Brian Turner, General Manager with Slalom. Brian says that while revenue is absolutely a critical indicator of the health of your business, you run into problems when you make it the leading indicator. You solution your rate and structure around a dollar, and you can backend the most important part of the solution—the value you bring to the client.

Find a breakdown of this episode here.

Are you concerned about hitting yourrevenue targets this month quarter or year? Your answer is value, primesolutions, a sales training and marketing optimization companyreveraging, the valueselling framework visit wwwdot value, Prime Solutionscom,and start accelerating your results. Youwere listening to the BTB revenueexecutive experience, a podcast, dedicated ee executives train theirsales and marketing tems to optimize growth, whether you're looking fortechniques and strategies were tools and resources. You come to the rightplace. Let's accelerate your growth in three to one: welcome everyone, O thebe to be revenue, executive experience, O' your host Hat Sanderson. Today wehave with this Brian Turner, General Manager was slow, N Consulting and, aswe pre for the show, we decided to focus. Our conversation primarily on arevenue should actually be viewed as a trailing. Although critical indicatorof the health of Your Business now, I know for many of our listeners thatprobably sounds like heure say we're all after revenue helping our customersget more revenue, Mak more money, but considering the increase in the numberof reports were seeing out there around sales experience. What BII expect it'spretty important perspective wanted. TDESPENDIVE time with Brian and Capturso Brian First. Thank you very much for taking time to be with this today.Thank you, Jo Prett God. This is a subject near and dear to our hearts,Paem as we as we figure out our next path and grow yeon a billion excellent.So little twist right out of the game, I like to try and frontload some of thevalue for this fomhe podcast for our listeners, and so I start usually withasking you know each of our guest. If you think back over the course of yourcareer- and there was a defining moment- something that happened- maybe change.Of course, your career give you a lesson that you learned that you stillapply today, I'd like to kind of understand what that is, what less youlearned and how it affected your career yeah. You know it really was thedeprescipice for Hel start up to Fallin Denver office and it had to do withjust transparency, accountability, and you know, for me it was as many ofisetseen. You know you get into the trenches on a tough project and you'reworking through different items and at some point, when the partnership isstrong, you just kind of succumbed to the fact that you're in this togetherand and how do you figure out how to do the right thing that transparency forme? Obviously you work through. I you getthe doonall solution. NEU averald program deliver that' in of the fun Marand the easy part to look at as success, but what I found was the extremeefficiency of being transparent, of taking complete accountability oftaking ownership and of that being a two way street, always the best way tofind a solution, no matter how how big the problem so there's a prettypoignant program project. I was on with the client to be unnamed in my old day and is you know I was a partner withthe big five and we sat down and we're just able to get inside our bubble as apartnership between you know, rather than two companies, two teamspartnering and being completely...

...transparent, a and it was amazing howquickly it turned around a complex program and delivered it as a team that,just watching that I realized there was a a huge sweet spot for I just goublingdown on the level o services t you can provide n and just having partnershipsrather than you know, a solution driving the problem, but a team. So Ican think of the exact client I can think of the exact program, but I thinkthe bottom line- lesson Thaf, weve, diven thoroculture here is just ouefficiency, transparency, partnership, ownership and mutual accountability andtransperencs is excellent in concept of when people can embrace it. It isphenomenal, agree with you. It can be uncomfortable for some, though right Imean it requires a level of accountability and authenticity thatcand be a challenge for some individuals. A'm curious how you guysovercame that at Slowlo Yeah, you know you've got to create a culturethroughout which is an interesting place from a consulting perspective,but a culture of learning in a culture of you know it's positive to be wrongif you're learning from it getting better and moving forward, you've seenit before you get into that knower mentality, whether you're in Salervyou're going to get yourself into trouble. Unless your you know one ofthe few that that truly knows more than everybody else, as opposed to you knowreally driving of culture of what Di we learn. Whatdi we grow. Where did webring value and it pretty quickly Freez up and IT IAND? It's pretty. It iscontagious throughout the organization people get hungry, for it terms, beable to sa to the table, and you know truly ask questions around a solutionand be listening for answers, rather than be listening for a spot to putyour answer in. If that makes sense, yeah completely completely not I haveto ask, I always do my homework and I notice you have a degree from Berkeleyand melecular biology. How did you end up going from melecular biology intothe big five and then into Sloem? Well, it turns out number one. I don't likeBlood Idon't think you're alone there. Idon't know you know Badovegel, but you start cutting things up in front of meand I don't feel so good. But you know I was getting out ofBerkeley in the earlys just before thecom boom, and you know, technology wwas obviously dominant and I had some catching up to do so. I can, U Know Ijumped into technology firm within the Big Five, because I thought I waspretty exciting and toking O someode whowas, going to give me a computer andteach me how to use it. So that was fun number two, the you know the logic thatyou have with an electocself biolas Yo does directly apply over it. Stillequational there'R, still solutions, you're, still analyzing varible dataand understanding kind of the best approach, and I like the idea of at theend, you know if the answer was correct or not is ob you little more gray areawhen it comes to. You know solutioning with an it, but again you can point tothe success on the value criteria: An thand. That's that's still, some thatcomforts me so probably more connection than you think andle bood andconsulting yeah. I guess it depends on...

...the client but yeah without a doubt. Sowhen we were prepene for the interview we wanted to talk about you now revenueas a critical, although pkaps trailing indicator of success and health of t ebusiness of unpack that a little bit forr listeners and help provide alittle bit more context. Yeah, you know, and it's by no means o the point torevenue not being a critical indicator of the health of Your Business. But forme you kn across the twenty five thirty years. I've been doing this when you'regoing after revenue is leafing indicator. You're solutioning aroundthat dollar you're solutioning around you know the rates, the structure, theitems and then you can back in the most important part of the solution, whichis the value you're bringing and you know for us. You start to look at whatis the value? Are you doing the right thing? Are you truly solving yourcustomers problems in the manner they need themsolves, rather than you know,applying your tools and selling the tools or assets you have to try tosolve their problems or try to rapply them as they will. Those things again,you know, can have some short term wins. The long term is you're trying tocreate a brand and really own a market as well. As you know, a culture withinyour organization. You'll fall short now. That being said, the revenueindicators absolutely critical in the stores. Jou. Think of you know, youneed your values, you need to be decleared, norse star. You need a greatculture within there, especially if you'R Your Business as Ourss, yourpeople, that's your product, and then you know how how you deliver thatproduct and how that product is being received in the market in the value.It's creating eventually look at those revenue numbers and they are the clearfoundation that not only show up the business is successful but allow you toadjust, you know, invest in a variety of theassets. You would need to Tu Continue Improve Your Business and involvedexcellent. So I'm curious thereis, you know everybody that I work with or dois always talked about. What's the number of the quarter for the half forthe year, what are the anual tars? What's the revenue markets share stufflike that by not focusing on it? Is that enabled largely because you guysare a private company or do you think if you were public and Hed Cherol? Isthat the answer to Wall Street that it would be? As let's say I don't say easy, but then itwould be a simple, perhaps yeah, you know a it ties into the leading versustrailing indicator and it really for US allows us to be proactive versusreactive. To you know, our clients need an what I mean by that is. You know westill look at obviously daily weekly monthly, quarterly annual revenue. Youstill have to break things into measerable chunks to be able to analyzethem. But having said, we don't have to react to them. Right use youranswerering to shareholders, and they want to know exactly what you're goingto eliver. In a quarter, an n an a better number, no matter what the storyoutweighs a longer term statement or vision, you get into trouble and if youknow, if I use an example, if you were to take, you know something as simpleas resources in people as your biggest asset and at's, who you are as acompany in our business, I've seen.

Private companies have to makedecisions on hiring and firing based on a three month projection, and if youhave a person, that's been with you for ten years. You know they're anexcellent resource, but for some reason you know Hick up on a client or youknow a market or Oilan gases and doing what she thought it was and he startedmaking moves to get rid of people just start. Looking at a number hey, that'sthe wrong thing: to do, for a culture you're, never going to build theloyalty ind, the culture that you want, but number two. You just look at itfrom a dollars and sense perspective. You're going to have to spend how muchmoney to rehire that person in the business value, ind the cost and theunefficiency Yo're creating there is- is an amazing one. If you do theanalysis, but to get an answer in a short term and a quarter to answer to ashareholder, a see moves like that made they're completely inappropriate, soboth from a culture perspective from a dollar perspective. It just gives you afreedom to look at the strategy of Your Business in a much more flowing way.Strategically. You still need to make moves. You still need to. You know,stay efficient, but you don't have to answer to a calendar Dat, that'sforcing some of those decisions and, more importantly, you know you starttalking to the board and shareholders. You can make move short term that youcould have gotten over Hump Quicker and had a much better foundation, long term,and it seems to be working. I mean you guys are growing. You know amazing. Youmentioned earlier headed towards a Billion Dollars Organization. That'sthat's pretty de impressive right! So normally I ask and expect, when I askyou know, what's the biggest challenge these days, that you're facing most ofthe people I talk to are most of the clients I work with Sawe need more leasEr. We need more revenue, one of O to I know from talking to Eric that thingsare going very well. So I'm curious when you look at you know specificallyDenver, maybe slallem as a whole. What are the biggest challenges and doesbeing private and focusing on a longer termman? Does that change thechallenges that kind of rise to the surface as the primary wants? Yeah youknow, and in terms of head thows, two questions the first one on one of thebiggest challenges as we grow. I point to a lot of companies, have a greatculture and can keep their arms around their people and contruly partner withthei clients. In that intimate way that we want to do, and it's about thatbillion mark, you can see some of those breaks happen. You know you needprocess to deal with that scalability. So for us the biggest challenge, but itis who we are, as I think, it'll completely differentiate as as acompany and differentiate because e soltting. Frankly, if we can figurethis out, but the biggest challenge will be how we can empower and bescalable, and you know we hit that two three billion to be able to bring theappropriate assets and knowledge to our clients, while keeping that small,local intimacy from a partnership from an understanding. Our clients needsfrom solving their problems rather than applying our solutions. So you know theone line around. That is, how do we maintain our culture intimacypartnership with our clients, while taking advantage of the success we'vehad to bring more assets to those clients to solve their most criticalproblems? I think the second part of your question is you talked about hey,you know. What's that downside to being...

...of the private company? There'sdefinitely the the ability to kind of take care of your people more to makemake decisions for the right reasons and an not have some of those outsideinfluences, but there's still a you know, there's a scale ability from aninvestment perspective from a dollar perspective. You know, I think itprobably brings another level of discipline in terms of understandingexactly what all the different factors are. Looking at in a market as wellallows a discipline internally on you know who what why and how you'rerunning things. So you can make up for that by just making sure you have thatdisapplintan accountability internally but yeah, it's you know it's kind oflike seeing the tax man makes you get some of those extra numbers togetherthat you know, but putting them on paper can show you different things ojust making sure we have enough of that process and diligence to to runourselves in that efficient, inappropriate way.But you know maintaining the ability to o. just always do the right thing. YeahI mean is a delicate balance for sure right, the process to scale withoutnothing out the that small intimate field that partnershould feel tat. IHAV salms known for I've, seen other agency struggle withit and en not crack that nut so atfoard to seein what you guys would guys dowith that as you move forward, when we were emailing back and forth, youstarted talking about four things: that kind of fall into the circle ofbusiness. From your perspective, investments and products, investmentsof people, Innovation and longer sales life cycle. Can you kind of impact thatcircle of business force and how you use it in the day today, OperationsYeah- and you know it all- comes back to bringing value, and that is our that'sour job. That's our responsibility for our clients is understanding the valueof bringing how we're bringing it. They expect you to have the best people.They expect you to be knowledgeable of their industry and bringing asset andproducts to make things more efficient. The same time, if you're just bringingall the tools at everybody else brings, you know the mamatter, how good afriend Yo, no matter how much you do the right thing and take care of him.They're still an end N and then result that rate and the mighty dollar and jotkind of Al of ight innovation comes in they do theydo want you to kind of not only be doing what you do well, but pushing theboundaries and bringing other items, and you know sometimes it's investingon projects with them. Sometimes it's our live base deal sometimes it's justbeing in innovative, and you know throwing ideas infesting in piolots tokind of show him what could be and a lot of that takes time, and if youmentioned at the end of that longer longer sale, syncom, that's a that's atough discipline! It's something we're going through right now. We have K ow alot of relationships where, as anybody that sells you know the best way tosell, is you know from the ground when you're working with the client ou knowhim really well, but it', the big world and you got to be able o bring enoughvalue from the outside to interest people to bring. You know a differentlevel of value when you've already have the partnership, and then they expectmore from you and and you ow them some of the payback for the time you spenton the ground and understanding both of those parts, and so when you look atkeeping the discipline on that longer sale cycle, obviously efficiency isstill important, doesn't mean you're...

...inefficient or you wait more days tomake closes or Oro. You O get the Clin exactly what they need, but it doesnmean kind of sitting on your heels and listening and making sure you'resolutioning right just like we talked about earlier on that transparency. Inthe end, the efficiency game. We wish that, with that transparency alwayscomes through it's the same n n, a sales life cycle right. If you can justtake that breast listen make sure you're really getting. That solutionkeeps you from having to go back. I mean there's nothing worse right than Ifiving. As you start to say, bus am going, and then you know your eightweeks and realized. There was a miscommunication on what one personthought they were saying when they said something so just taken that Brashmaking sure you are clear on everything from the highest level business valueproposition through the steps and tools they're going to deliver it through animplementation, absolutely critical, so yeah when we say longer sales lifecycle.It is about that kind of relationship. Listening solutioning I kind of at atthe ends degree, but it is not. Obviously you know a slow. Let's justwait and see how it comes right, so whoso with an organization that scalingand growing as much as slom there's a lot of that trust. That's put on yourconsultants right! So how do they? How do they listen correctly? How do theyinterfaceand and deliver on the solemn brand deliver on the expertise thatexpected I'm curious? How as you grow and add people to the you know the Slamfamily? How do you enable them so there's some level of consistencyacross the way they interact right is ther. Is there a secret, Sau sex, it'ssomething as Soen agency struggle with another consulancy struggle with and asyou get bigger on that scale side, I'm curiously, how do you as a part of yourhiring process there tere's certain things you're looking for when you'rehiring, so you get some level of consistency? Is Their Training Programor mentor program. You guys implementim it's kind of what I'm paing that yeahand I think the answers yes, throughyou got to drive it's so deep inyour culture and words, or you know we all know were wors your one thing, butthen the actions are bigeing, so you've got to just live it. The number oftimes we sit around our table and we're looking at anything from a W externalproject that we're working with the client to an internal situation with anemployee or a career pass or compensation o know being able to pullout the hey. What's the right thing to do here, because we have a clear valueof always do the right thing. Let's put that on the table and again everythingeverything's, never perfect, but if people here, when you're balancing backon those items of you know, do the right thing always smile joy learn,listen when they hear you applying those it circles itself on that culture.So from you know, when we're interviewing people, I'V, usually thelast interview and when you talk to these people coming in you're, assumingthey have the skills, an assets that th they're going to need to bear to kindof solution, andsolve problems, but we had to culture item right, fhrom thefront and it's not a bad thing. It's not a your one of us you're, not it'sreally about understanding who they are,...

...how they want to work, what they wantto do. What experiences they've seen how they reacted, what their leadershipstyle is, and you can you can drain that and then you can see which, whichitems you know people may have gaps, but they they're here to evolve thoseyou know then Yo. Even within a company one of Mor clear items you people,people can leave from a consulting perspective. We have pretty lowactrition here in the twelve thirteen percent range, which, for a consultingfirm, is extremely really love. But you know at the same point, do believe n,it's a good thing if they go off to be clients if we've envolved in thecorrect way, and so we there's another clear statement here, which is we wantthis to be the best stop for someone's career, whether that's one year or tenyears or twenty years. It's just about. How are you growing learning, evolvingand building your skills and enjoying the team you're working with you pullthat in from the interview process through training, we have very detailedleadership, training programs that are about seedback transparency. I thinkthe the further up you, you move from a leadership perspective or from aresponsibility perspective in this company. The the more feedback you'rereceiving that's be inverse to a lot of companies right,and I think you just drain that through and it's it breeds that servantleadership, which breeds kind of the culture of really being comfortable,bringing up ideas. You know no ideas incorrect. How are you learningproductive conflict? All those items it just starts to bleve throughout theorganization, but it's got to be maintained and kind of nourished everyday. Yeah, it's not it's, not something you can just talk about and put on theside like you have to live it right. You have to Liveit, it has to be real,it has to be some of the people are experiencing day. In a day out. It'simpressive, I mean Slam, has gotten a number of awards for the culture andhen reviews from people that have been there. It's it's pretty impressiveaccomplishment, although I have to believe not particularly easy. Do yourun into some consultants that come on board at times who maybe aren't ascomfortable with that level of transparency or or that level offeedback you need? Definitely itdo definitely take some getting used to. You can still have t days on theseedback, but you start to get hungry for it and it's again back to just howefficient the transparency is you it just. It starts to grow on itself, butit is a challenge and it is, I mean, that's e. We have a pretty longinterview process and you know you can you can see that on occasion on some ofthe on some of the social sites and half the cannidys come through andthey're like wow, you guys drain this I've met so many people. I really feellike. I understand a company. I've never walked through a door of acompany and really had such a clear vision of what I'm getting into, andothers are kind of. Like hey interview, five wit still. I need a job deal, those things out, but heconginuous feedback. You know it's not always perfect. It's not a. You know.You've got to understand what those gaps are and then becomble with it, andit's pretty interesting. We do very detailed survey called an SES surveyfor US internally and with our clients- and you know it's always a toughbalance with clients fore. Theyre Ike really you're going to send me servtingme a past to, but externally or...

...internally, when they see you hold upthe results and then react to hem. A lot of our clients now have beenpartner in this for for a while look forward to getting that annual survey,because they know that you know they're going to have a meeting with us tounderstand what those results are and the you see immediate actions, it' thesame thing internaly. You know you get feedback on everything we're working onaround. You know: ascetation prodaction, career paths, diversity and inclusion.When you hold those things up, as I day, we got a really bad score here andyou're comfortable with it and you own it, and then you kind of walk throughYore, some things we're going to try and then you're even able to hold up.You know whether it's out of quarterly or you know or monthly calls orwhatever you're doing talktail hours Oreeryo connected with the team Whithyou hold those gaps up just as much as you hold. He, the positive items.People start to see. It's real. I think the first time our CEO had to do thisstarted back to two thousand and eight. You know andyhe noticed the the initialsurveys would get more and more information about the things we need todo better and I quated it to you know: Ys, my wife. What can Brian Improvenext to you might give you a topic or two but gos to proe them and really work hardon him. The next time ye give her a survey. She's Gointa have about fifteenright nots e o aattention to it. So those surveys have that result. Clientskind of lean in more the the internal team see how hard we're working on itand it creates a pretty Tis, positive inpact in terms of driving andmaintaining that culture, because the minute you sit on it, you know thatwhole day, one day to company the minute you sit on it, you're going tostart to lose the culture and breakere gon be able to Storyono you're. Gettingbig ore all were losing this piece, O we're losing tatpece in e reality isyou've, always got to be tiguring out what your whath, your evolution is notjust to stay ahead of a pack, but just just continue to get better yeah andthen that culture becomes critical. I mean you got okay, so when you hiresomebody, you got to make sure that they're in a place where they canaccept that type of feedback and I've seen it to the dude that I myselfincluded GE hungry for that feedback. Right. U always always want to getbetter. The other side of that coin, though, is when you're dealing with acustomer, not sometimes if it's a newer customer it'll be harder that sameconsultant that has to be willing to accept feedback has to sometimes beable to tell a client that they're headed in the wrong direction right. Soit's the other side of that soft skill, I'm surious how you guys test for thator or how you enable that across the team, because sometimes your job is totell the customer that they're wrong or perhaps there's a better way to do itright. Yeah, no question and that's you know, there's always an art to thescience and Itin every situation's different,but we ageit back to that transparence again, it's not it's not a callostransparency. It's not a Leao just got to get back to here's the values.Here's why we're driving this ound heres whawe're, giving this information,if you're being honest, you're, owning it and owning your side ofaccountability as well. You know not just kind of pushing or leading onthings that seems simpler to communicate. It comes through and it isnot always easy right. We've had to walk away from clients that you canjust tell Wont Line Up. We've had plans...

...that are surprise when we rollresources off and say you know, we talk to your CEO and there's an extra gag oryou a we expect to be bringing from Slalan you're, not getting that in thissituation, so we're moving on. They would be used to servicesorganization and think something like T at. You must be getting a higher ratefor that person or a higher rate to that project somewhere else for theseiice courses of, but you just stick to it and you're consistent with it. Youdo it for the right reasons. Those partnerships a build and they realizethat that's really their culture and it builds off itself. They see doing itwith each other and they see you open to that seedback and asking for it andreacting to it. They start to lean in the majority of the time, but it isstill a science. A are an art. You know that you mix with the science andtheres there's Times you got a soft shoot a bit. Yeyou have to have the discipline tonot give soft messages. There's a you know, there's a difference in beingable to say thing is a productive way, ind a supportive way and having astrength to be able to walk away. We've had clients where we do assessmentsover technology, obviously won't won't go into the exact technologies wereanalyzing, but we did a recommendation of Technologya and they said Yep. Wegot it and kind of looking through all the different factors. You told uswe're going to we're GOINA lean with technology B, but we want you toimplement it. You know it was just pretty interesting to go way tosackifor Partrin with you, and we really feel this is better for yourbusiness. If they had changed our minds with some variables we hadn't seen ordone, and let's go down that path, but it was more of a Yep. We agree with you.We understand it, but we have more of these resources. We're going to movedown this direction and you k ow the reaction initially when we said wellgreat, but of course we're not going to do that. Two million dollarimplementation because we don't feel it's the best for you and we did tellyou wee partnen with you. theryaction was kind of like well, that's cute, butgril up. This is you know in the end, is his business and we want you toimplement it. An what we did was kind of say. Look we'll continue to supportto walk through love to you know, sink with you monthly, to understand howit's going and make sure our items that we were trying to keep your eye on araccurate. But we can't move down. Have that program right. It's just so getsback to. Are you being true to your word to your values Truat, to whatyou're saying to thim? Eventually it pends them around, and then you knowsay it nicely think a little about the exactadjectives were using with clients pe Om, PLAC yeah. I have been known totell my wife. I don't have a problem with what you're saying I have aproblem with how you're saying all right. So, let's Change Directionhere, a little bit. We ask all of our guess two standard questions towardsthe end of the interview you are as a revenue executive. You are a potentialprospect or target for some. Our listeners people want to get in frontof you, sell you somethingself some problems, I'm curious from yourperspective. What is the most effective way to break through the noise and getyour attention bring something to you that may provide you, the dever groupSolm as a wholesome value? What captures your attention and what seemsto work the best. You know, that's a good question and we do get. We get aton of kind of whether it's cold or...

...relationship pushes or Ididn't dopeople connecting, and obviously we have to do that ourselves, so it insinour or ceois a two innervator D, and I think he often especially as we weregrowing, we take calls with with salespeople to understand the style ofthe process, how they were doing it and kind of wic would enjoy the back andforth from that perspective. Just in that Learner Mentality Sur. As I lookat myself and I work with our sales team- and I look at who we connect withand why you know, there's the easy things like having the personalconnection from a a credibility standpoint or those items is easy, but that canalways be the case. So for me, it's really when the value propositionthey're giving is clear and connected, and what I mean by that is, you knowthey fix top through what I am who we are, what we do, and they may notunderstand it all. They understand enough that their initial, why they'rereaching out to me makes sense from the value perspective and then it you knowit. It's the connection at that at that next point, which is a connection intouch. How are you doing it? You know the consistency is a customized. Areyou able to do it obviously, any time I can grab a coffee or a beer withsomeone to really hear them. You'll know in thirty minutes, if it's anothersales pitcher, if they're, really listening and and going o connect backour values. Are you? Are you understanding what we do? Who we areand then applying what your solution is or what your product is and how itbrings value? And at that point it's and then Ho are Yu. And how do you canact because there are a lot of great products out there? Actually I that,and so is that type of Approath, something that you guys are still in inyour self force and and work to make sure that they're effective at doingwith new customers or new markets or expanding existing accounts. We do andit's a different approach right, a l, a lot of my bds job. A lot of theirresponsibility is to make sure we have the best brand in the market and andthe best reputation. So you know they sell. They know from the beginning oftheir sale cycle, whether it's with exist, ING, partnent, they've known fortwenty years or a brand new partner. In the end, it's going to be about thevalue they deliver and that's not just from a you know, credential perspectiveor or being able to talk to the next client about some of the great work wedid. But you know their jobs to make sure that we said, or we did what wesaid we were going to do so. They have a big part of that up front but havingthem on that closhe on the backgend kind of completes that cycle. If youwould and probably affects how you sell up front as well right and Knowig,knowing you're going to ask what was the exact value you expected, wethought it was this and we think we brought it in this fashion. Are you onthe same page you're thinking of those questions from the Geggo and then theother end is just BDS are great with people or at the emotional intelligenceis something we lean on, and so they have an ability to create thatrelationship where they can get the true, the true feedback on how we getbetter, how we continue and how things are going Ye often times whether it'syou know from from a business strategy perspective or fromait perspective.Whichever end of the business were...

...working on you get in the trench withthat client, they may say yeah. I know things are great because you've beenfighting with them an in the positive way. You know o fighting the battlewith them and Pran and get getting the program done with them. So they don't.You know, need to give you that last ten percent sometimes you's got toencourage that, and then you know the bite. The Relationship Tho can trulyprotect that at's, not just being seen at someone who's selling the circlingaround rearly devil check, they're getting what they want. That's Selt andand that's where you get kind of the next level of information to envolveith business, and so you know our vdes are cot, just as much on kind of whatthey bring to the market, an the value they deliver as much as how did it goalong the way and how o the client feel right gets back to all the feedfack weget in surveys that we can play that directly applies Anto. Do there in theend and yeah it's the balance, it's the same balances when we talk about thevalue of always doing the right thing. That means always doing right thing forclients and always doing the right thing for your people. Those are twotwo things that it's some you know at times can force you to balance others,but, but if you concentrate on both of them, you end up with the with theright path. interestings. I should have asked this question question earlier.It's something you just said jogged it for me that when your bds work withSonn a lot of agencies, Ore consellancies that I've worked withthere's this natural friction right between execution D and Beaty Yoursaveswe used to joke. I just interview March tag from KPMG. We joked about the magicbubble. Right, Yeu always kept execution in a magic bubble. I let thembelieve that revenue just kind of fell off the trees, but what you're sayingsounds like the BDS are actually integrated into those teams, a lot morecohesively and am y understanding that correctly, and if so, how has thathappened or, however, you guys, you know, enabled that to happen. You areunderstanding it correctly and it's you know it's being involved throughoutthat process. Our BDS are responsible, for you know, opening a door fitchingan idea and getting out they're responsible for getting all the rightpeople in the room to bring the right solution and they're a part ofeverything from creating that solution to creating the staffing for thatsolution. Understanding the Skale steps thatre going to be on there and thenthey're on the check INS throughout the project on how it's going right andthat's not just from a tactical and process perspective, but back to theHOUSTE client fealing. How are they doing? Where are we they're criticalathout, so the BDS aren't seen simply as a sales asset that goes and opensdoors for us. They are in the leadership meetings, part of theleadership team I get the best read of the market and how we're doing and howour brand is doing from them. Given internally right, you watch who theywant on their teams when it's the most critical personal project for the Cliet,a right, you oearn a lot about your people, you watch which which assetsthey sell. Of course they get back to the old reveny discussion. Of course,the Ones Tho create great revenue to Lookin at those, but you know ifthere's something that we have a gaping in the business they'll see it prettyquickly when they're not pushing in or when they shy away from a solution. Imean we need a strength, and you know the people in assets we have withinthat practice, so they theyare absolutely considered a critical partof the team and involved throughout the...

...lifestyme co, now theres skill thatdoes have to do with opening and listening and connecting, but at thesame point there, no more or less piece of the puzzle of the entire in gradedteam. That brings that solution, O the clan excellent excellent. I love thatperspective. It's difficult I've seen it's been difficult for some Agenciesanthat I've worked with to pull that off. I'm glad you e that you guysincorporateit all the way through. So I m just wanted to hey here's a meetingand bring this mart people. Let them close a deal and then it kind of fallsapart. So I'm glad to hear that you guys are are doing that right. So oneone! Last question for on one IEM on that chat, is you know if I look atsome of the bes they've been with us for more in a decade and they onlyserve Colorado, so they're going to see these clients up and down again, sothey are prodecting not not just in to do the right thing, mentality whichthey do but they're protecting their network and that's their job rightthers are keep their repucation ind therr their partnerships alive as well.So that is where that kind of local intimate model I talked about helpsextremely well connected. I mean from the BEUT's on Er team that I've ve hadthe chance to speak with and and connect with very well connected.Definitely have the Denver Market of the Someon, the pulse of that all right.So one last question: I Wundt be respectful of time, but we ask all ofour guests for what we call an acceleration insight. So if you had theopportunity to tell inother sales or marketing more professional serviceexecutive, one piece of advice that you feel like would help them or theirteams make their number beat their targets. Be Better tomorrow than theyare today. What would that be? And why a good question you know, I think itapplies even more so to you, Co to sales and marketing and professionalservices, but I think just in general, in life, but especially in those spaces,you can't GAM the system right you, he a game things for so long to ely game.The system of the process in the end, but hard work and effort is hard.Workan effort and you're going to need that to be successful right. You mightBui l a fine pockets between there, but it just comes down to O. Are youputting in the extricycles? Are you following through? Are you addressingthose gaps that you know you have, or you kind of pushing them off so back tohardwork and effort now believe in what you're doing and in back to even how Iknow lean on my bds now very different from when we're starting out as acompany still protecting their people, but I would watch every reaction. Everyperson, every aspect, every practice that we were building base. You couldlearn so much whether they were believing in it or not. So if you're, asalesperson or a marketing person W, how much easier is your job back tothat transparency? If you believe in what you're doing doesn't have to beperfect, whit is understand exactly what it is you're doing where youbringing the value, ow that and believe in it, and then, where there's gaps,how are you dressing us and kind of being transparent on those, but then,in the end it all just comes down to. He got a work hard and you got to putin the effort, and you know if you're being accountable. So if you can getout there you support, then you hold yourself just as compaccounable,perfect, perfect Wa appreciate that insight all right ever one. That is theend of this episode. Please check us...

...out at BTB. Revezaccom share theepisode with friends, Family Coworkers. If you like, whuld you heae, do me afavorite redister of you on hi tunes, we're tracking to get into the new andnoteworthy over there, so we need to get apples attention brian. I can'tthank you enough for your time today, hus been an absolute pleasure to haveyou on the show, a Jad thanks man. It was a lot of fun thanks for letting mechat a little bit, but I got to look forward to seeing seeing where the goesand getting some feedback and and contenue in this conversation, it's itit critical in today's Day and age on, as as your as your build noun services,an selling excellent. Well again, thank you. Thank you. Everyone for listeningand bribe for these evaluablences cannot think Oenough, I'm sure listensto benefit from them until we talk next time with you in the group of Slou,nothing but the greatest success. I thank tic cure all right. You've been listening to the BTBrevenue executive experience to ensure that you never miss an episodesubscribe to the show, an itunes for your favorite podcast player. Thank youso much for listening toll NEX TIME.

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