The B2B Revenue Executive Experience
The B2B Revenue Executive Experience

Episode · 4 years ago

Brian Burns on 5 Things to Look for in a New Sales Position

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

It’s common for sales professionals to move around a lot. In fact, the average tenure of a sales executive is just 18 months.

Brian Burns, host of The Brutal Truth About Sales & Selling, sat down with Chad Sanderson, Managing Partner, Value Prime Solutions, to discuss what salespeople need to look for when taking the next step in their career.

You're listening to the BB revenue executive experience, a podcast dedicated to helping the executives train their sales and marketing teams to optimize growth. Whether you're looking for techniques and strategies or tools and resources, you've come to the right place. Let's accelerate your growth in three, two, one. Welcome everyone to the BB revenue executive experience. I'm your host, Chad Sanderson, and today we're talking about the five things that you look for in a new sales job. Sales is a dynamic profession. A lot of people have a tendency to change, working for different organizations, and so the question always comes up. What should you be looking for in a new sales roll? What is it that's going to set you up for success and sure that the support you need from the organization you're working for is there? What types of things should you be looking for that maybe you're not thinking about when you're really concerned about landing that next job? Keep in mind that the vast majority of sales executives average tenure is eighteen months and when exhales executives are switching, they have a tendency to switch the sales teams as well. What we want to do is provide you some insight. Brian Burns and I are going to break down some of the things that we look for you in new sales positions and things that we think you should be paying attention to as you start to think about and contemplate your next move. So, without further ado, let's jump right into the conversation with Brian. Hey, Chad, thanks for joining us again. Hey, let's talk about the top five things that you look for in a new sales job. The you know what, the first one for me, for me personally, is leadership. I need to know that the people that I'm going to be working for and or with can teach me something. I don't know if that's normal for everybody, but for me, if I'm going into an organization, I'm constantly trying to, you know, better myself, whether I'm going in is an individual contributor or I'm running sales or running sales and marketing. I want to make sure that there are other people that have a leadership style that is conducive to, you know, self, exploration and growth. And if there's not somebody there that can teach me something, then all that happens is I end up getting in trouble. Yeah, it just gets ugly really fast. Yeah, I mean mine was number one was manager, you know, because I've been with a bad manager, a couple of bad managers, and it just doesn't work, where either it's either a personality conflict, to style conflict or, you know, the person to you know, has a preference to some other reps and is unfair, or just has checked out. And I've seen a lot of bad sales managers. Yeah, I actually had wanted a client. I won't give you the time frame because somebody listen to mine. Actually, Abibit tell where I was. But I have a client who I'm sitting there talking to him. You know, we're in we're in queue for now and the push should be on. And this sales manager actually said to me, well, we hit quota halfway through q three, so you know we're good for the year. And I and I you know, it was one of those moments where you're where I'm like, okay,...

I am I'm in here as a consultant and so I need to keep my mouth shut because I can say things that your boss wouldn't tell you. But I need to make sure I really temper it, because that to me, that's it's week leadership, it's week management. You're not your goal is to make as much money for the company as possible and if you're over quota, you got to have accelerators or something on your complaint or your team does. So why aren't we pushing even harder, like let's set a record? So if for me, a big part of it, I would say second one for me would be the drive, the drive of the organization and the the rest of the team. Are you really just there to get across the finish line or are you really there to loop it right and get across the finish line twice before your competition does? Want? If you can find that type of organization in those types of people, there's a great deal of energy and excitement that keeps you focused when you know sales is an up and down kind of thing. So if you can work with those types of people, that carries you through those those rough times. Yeah, I mean if the company's got to be the right fit for you, because if they don't like sales people or they they don't want to compensate. Fore and that's existed. You know, I've been at a company where that you had the necessary evil attitude and you know they paid commission on receivable as opposed to booking, and you'll like sometimes you wait and you know ninety hundred and twenty days from the time you close that Deel to actually getting you forgot about it. You know you didn't forget about it, but you're like, Oh God, finally they paid and you and that's not really the sales you know, once the company accepts the order and it's on the company, right. If if the company that don't doesn't think they're credit worthy, that's one thing and you you take it on consignment or something. I actually had a CEO. I work for a company and during the interview process, you know you're I was going going into to run the sales organization and I'm interviewing with everybody else's director of strategy, VP of strategy, VP attack, all the stuff, and they all tell me, hey, you know, your final interview is gonna be with the CEO and just so you know, he really doesn't like salespeople. And I'm just kind of like okay, all right, well, I know a lot of CEOS like that. What blew me away was the first thing in the CEO said to me on the phone, was after the introductions, was hey, just so, just so you know, I absolutely hate salespeople. And I'm like, I'm wondering to myself, is this really where I need to be? Is this really a battle I want to fight? Because if you don't understand the role that sales plays in company growth, especially in that complex services industry that we were in, then I think there might be some bigger issues here and I'm probably just going to once again end up getting in trouble. Right and I the two times that that existed, neither company really did well. I was interviewing with the founder and I go what, what don't you like about certain sales? Well, I don't like greedy sales people. What does that mean to you? And he goes, you know, you know that the commission it's kind of a gift. And I'm like, is the equity a gift? You know, won't just spread that around, right,...

...is like everybody else thinks. You know, is easy for them or easy for other people, but hard for them. Oh yeah, everybody wants to be in sales until quoters handed out. It's a quoters get handed out right everybody's like a man that sales sounds so easy, it sounds so fun. You guys make a lot of money. So all right, the successful ones make a lot of money, but there's a huge risk reward. You know, I was joking just a couple weeks ago with a client and I said, you know, look, there's a reason the divorce rate in complex be to be enterprise sales is so high. There's a reason I'm want number to right or sort too. It's like this is this can become an all consuming thing and and it's you have good years and if you're really good, your badgears aren't really horrible, but you're always you know, you're not going to be guaranteed at a specific amount of money every two weeks. It's about the quota and the performance. And so don't fall in love, you know, marketing people or consultants or whatever, with this concept you have in your head about what sales is. You really need to understand it. It is a discipline and it takes an approach and it takes a level of expertise and commitment that every type of discipline needs. And so don't hate us, because we're willing to take the rist ask work with us to make sure that we're all successful in the add if you can get that collaboration, and maybe I would say for me that's probably my third point would be the ability for the organization as a whole to collaborate, you know, with the sales team, not keep them in a silo. Right that that's something I'm always looking forward to. Now that I've taken jobs, I'll be honest where the sales team has been siloed, because I think it'll be fun to break it down. It's not not always fun. I don't know, maybe it's maybe I'm a hell little masochistic, but I'm just kind of all right, let's break down the silos and you guys have to understand, you know, what sales is all about and who sales people are. If they're willing to do that, great, let's let's do it. When they're not, it makes for a very long year. Now, how how have you done research on a company before you take it and, you know, give us an example of one time you'd either made a mistake or you kind of you made that emotional decision, but as all right. So typically for me, the research starts with, you know, I'll of course want to look at all, you know, the how they're doing financially. So if they're public, I'm going to go check outks. I'm going to listen to him analyst calls and stuff. But when it comes to the cultural stuff, you know there's things like glass door and you're got to take it all the grain of salt right, because you know the people that have a tendency to put stuff up the most, of the ones that are disgrunt old or whatever. You read enough of those, you can figure out that you know some of them maybe got rubbed the wrong way. Are they weren't given something they thought they deserve? But I'll start to try and get a sense for that. If I can, I will try and make sure there's somebody in my network where somebody in my network can connect me with somebody that works in that company, and so then then I can get an inside scoop and I can understand how they're how they're operating, what's the internal culture like? How are they structured? You know, from somebody else's perspective other than the people that are trying to hire me.

So when I go in for the interview, I'm very prepared with a lot of very specific questions. I want to fill the gaps on my understanding of what they look like, kind of threedimensionally, not just what you look like on the web or just what your people are saying about you, but where are you also planning to go? WHAT'S THE VISION? Now you can do all of that and do it really well and still make a crappy choice, which I have done. For me, though, it wasn't it wasn't about the people, it wasn't about it was even about product or product road map. It was I was looking for at that time. I was specifically looking for an opportunity to work with a company that was about to go through the IPO process. I've done acquisition after acquisition and sold companies and done all that. I just wanted to try something new. So I made a decision to join a company based on the fact that their current plan when they hired me was to go IPO in the next eighteen months. Perfect, not a problem. I can take care of North American sales, we can get it up where it needs to be and do that. Six weeks after I took that job, they had a board meeting and CEO Calls Me and says so we kind of change our mind. I think we're going to go the acquisition path, and I was like, all right, I just went through a really ugly acquisition. Actually wasn't an acquisition, it was a takeover and it was ugly and I don't want to do that again. So I appreciate that. You guys have to do what's right for your business. I was like said six weeks in. I said I'll finish out the first half of the year because I don't want to leave you high and dry, but I'm going to tell you right now I'm not sticking around for the long haul now. I was lucky enough. They were really they were really understanding about that. They understood because I've been very clear up front about what I was looking for. They worked with me on that and again I didn't want to leave him high and dry. But it no matter how much research you do, at some point you won't know. You know, like we were talking about before, if the car you just purchased really fits you well, and so you get an opportunity to go out and take it through those curves and push it to its limits. So, no matter how much research you do, there's going to be that awareness and that that realization that comes from actually being in the trenches in that organization. Yeah, because that that honeymoon is very short, ridiculously short. It's like two or three days. And and what I found is typically the reputation of a company is Pretty Soall, I mean pretty accurate when you start hearing, you know, just grunt old people or people that are, you know, head hunters, that are putting you in touch with people who used to work there to warn you. And I've gone against their warnings and I'm you know and that the warnings are there for a good reason and you know it open and plus, you know you you want to find out. You know, we already talked about the manager. You got to understand the company, the culture. How that not just how they've used sales, like what you said. You know, I think, are they looking to get acquired or they growing or they shrinking? You know, a lot of my decisions were, you know, came right after they got a round of funding and the typical thing was to go higher. Ten salespeople. Now...

...they're going from one or two to ten, you know, a literally overnight, you know, hip thrown in a room, you get your laptop. Then you're thrown back out in the field when you get ninety days to sell something and you're like yeah, no leads, no market reputation, the products kind of sketchy. No lead. Already do it. Said no leads. You know your s see your your assistance. Have never demoed the product before. It's like, and they expect return immediately. Oh yeah, and then you go through the okay, the first quarter they fire one person. The second quarter they fire too. Oh my God, they start to prune the tree really quick. Yeah, and then one of those things, though, have I mean I've noticed a couple of organizations I've worked for. If you can get past that, you know, hey, we hate sales people, kind of think, because I actually did take that job with that CEO said he hated sales people, and we were successful. We did some really cool stuff and we were able to sell the company. But if you can get, you know, to that point where you can help the organization understand sales. Now a lot of sales people don't want to do this. I just want to go sell. But if you're an organization that says, Hey, you hit the ground in ninety days, let's assume it's a be to be complex sale. It's not. It's not a transactional sale. But if it's a be to be complex sale they're giving you ninety days to generate a return, then somebody needs to have a conversation with that CFO about what it really takes to ramp up in complex sales cycles. They'd never like that conversation, but if at least they're willing to listen, there at least willing to engage that it's may be worth worth taking the risk. Otherwise you just watch them proven the tree. There goes one, there goes down, there goes three, and now now you're not doing you're not doing your job. You're looking for your next gig because you know the guillies teens coming. So you know it can be really disruptive to some of those organizations, but it is and also can be extremely fun. It's kind of the wild wild west in those situations. Yeah, and then today, where you have, you know, a lot of sad stuff with a prices or a lot less. And as opposed to that, you know the multimillion dollar enterprise deals. That took forever, but you know. So you can get maybe a beach head. You know, you can get a couple of customers up and running and stuff and and then he gets some momentum going and but that's it is so hard to judge from the outside. What what a great company, a great product, you know, and I think you have to go on like, you know, gtw crowd and what a people saying about the product. You know, how much funding did they have? You know, and I got so good at it. Go okay, they got this much funding, they got these net number people. So I know what the burn rate is. So they've got nine months to either get, you know, enough business or another round of funding, or they start laying people off. So you can kind of guess how much time they have. And then you got to like ask them, you know, what are your expectations? You know, how long did does it you think it's going to take? And if if they have no idea or it's all, you know, some MBA, you know, spreadsheet that they put together. It's like that's like, you know, building a...

...rocket on a white board and then going out to you know, Kate Carnafril and hoping it's going to work. You know, let's like this thing and see what happens? Yeah, happens. Who wants to get in there? Who wants to sit up top? And Too often, you know, you do not want to be in that, you know, blazing firebomb. That usually it turns out in a most startups. I think today people are starting slower, you know, with an inside, you know, sales development roll and then maybe going on outside. And you know, hopefully you know, the people listening want to be on the outside possess where all the fun is. Yeah, and it's interesting. I mean, I guess maybe we're talking too much about my age, but you've definitely seen like right before the, if I say the bubble burst, for those that don't know what I'm talking about, im some of the Internet bubble, but right before the bubble burst, all those you know, I was working for a threedimensional photography company and it was awesome product. We're working with NASCAR and Palm Malave and all these things. But all of a sudden the bull burst is no more funding and those organizations that had scaled up and just done what you said, you know, here's ten people, throw them in a room, give him a laptop, here's a quick demo, go make us money. Those are the ones that I saw suffer. Now, I think, you know, typically today we're seeing people having learned from those lessons. And you know, you mentioned the sales development role. To see companies, the ste you know, that are fifty million or last hundred million to actually be investing in sales development early, it's something you never would have seen ten fifteen years ago in the startup realm. So it seems to me like it's getting better. I mean maybe I don't know, maybe I'm just jaded and skeptical because of the crap I went through when I was coming up, but it seems better today. But you still run into those instances where they're like, okay, look, we invested in sales development and so we didn't just hire ten people and put them in a room. We hired ten people, we put them in a room, we gave him three days of training and a laptop and then put them in the field. Right. So you still have to kind of have to temper that perspective with, you know, what people are actually saying versus what they're doing. Yeah, and I think today we have to convince management that the outside is where the money is, not the expense, and I think there's too many CEOS I talked to or VP's of sales that I talked to you today that all they care about is the cost of sales. What you care about is the top line. That's what sales job is. It's not the bottom line. And you know, I've got a lot of clients with I. All we want to do it a hundred percent inside it, and I go here, never going to get an enterprise deal on the inside. Right. Right, and you look at you know I pick on hub spot too much, but that's why they have and won the market. Marquetto and Eloquoi had an outside sales force, right, and they and up spot doesn't want to do that and it's like okay, you don't have to do it. But what you suffer from is the college kids are going to get the next order. They're going to get the beach head, right, but the but also what's going to happen is somebody else in that account is going to...

...want another product and they're going to have some sales rep coming in talking to the CMO, not talking to the the ops people or the digital marketing people. They're going to the talking two levels above you and they're like, oh, and they're going to deframe the the toy, and this I mean we. I should have brought this up during our demo discussion. Is the other key part of a demo is a lockout. You can come up with something that you have that nobody else has, like like your Camaro, with you know some feature, some capability, horsepower, whatever it is that nobody else has. Boom you won. Yeah, well, up spots are great for that out. I'll be right up front. I do. I use hub spots sales stuff and and I do enjoy using it. But I run in a small company. On the enterprise side, people buy from people. So if you know Marquetto at Eloqua, they're going up and they're talking to the actual buyers, they're talking to power about what really makes a difference to their organization. Hub spots inside team they're really good. I mean I've I've had some great conversations with a couple of those guys. If we want to talk about the specifics of what hub spot is going to do with this feature for my business, for that. But when you're talking enterprise, you know you go back to people buy from people and they make emotional decisions. So if you don't have somebody sitting with them and helping them through that journey. You just think you're going to call them once or twice, maybe turn on your camera, you know when you've actually done your hair and put on a shirt instead up is right that that that's going to work? It doesn't work. It just doesn't, and it's not because the company's approaching it the wrong way. It's just kind of ignoring the the human factor in complex sales, having somebody, you know, a salesperson, that can be consultative, that can be that, you know, guiding light at to solve your problems. That has to happen in person and it requires trust and credibility and rapport and that's really difficult to get and maintain when all you are as a face on a screen. You can't and, let's face it, out you know you. We've all done, certainly you and I have done, you know, the thing on the phone, but then you go and you meet someone. The dipt difference is it's not twice as good, it's ten to a hundred times better and tend to a hundred times more effective and you find out things that you will never find out on a screen sharing APP. At all. No, yeah, well, I'll tell you more. I mean, you get to walk okay, so let me just think about it. With the screen share, I mean, and this is probably the kind of captain obvious stuff, but with a screenshirt, the meeting starts at ten o'clock, you turn it on at ten o'clock, you start talking, you turn it off at thirty. If I'm their facetoface, you're coming out to get me in the lobby at forty five. We're talking as we go through the office. Maybe you're giving me a tour, we're stopping to get some coffee before we go in, and then after the means if you got to walk me out, that's another thirty minutes of time where you get to build. Just focus on building rapport and make sure that if you didn't set a hook in your thirty minutes, you know you have that opportunity to do it as you're walking out.

I think the technology is awesome, it's great. It allows us to do a lot of stuff at scale, but it I haven't seen it necessarily be as effective at all when it comes to building that type of rapport and that trust that that happens when you're pressing the flash, you're shaking somebody's hand, you're looking him in the eye and they believe you when you say I'm going to help you solve this problem and here's how I'm going to do it. There's no substitute for that right. And they will coach if they want you, they want your product, they will coach you on how to get it done. They will tell you who's really full of crap, who's who's who, the real deal is. You know what the real timing is. You're not going to get that on the phone. It's to guard it. It's too cold. It's in personal there's no very little bit of trust is built there. You are a drune own to them. You Arel, you know, a live video to them that they could they want to limit that time for and you know when I talked to you know, CEO, and they want to make deals bigger. I got. You got to have somebody who will go to the customer. You know, whatever the configuration that looks like. You know, literally I was at a cup company where I was the only outside guy. Now I sold three quarters of the company's revenue and one deal right, and it was like, Oh, oh, and go that never would have happened, you know. And eighty percent of my selling was still over the phone. But when I got together with people, you know, who would like five miles from where I live, I'd go, I'd sit down, I'd find out what the real issues are. I blocked out the competition that was a hundred times bigger than us that, you know, this deal wasn't even big to them. This deal was big to us and I was like, you know what's going to happen, you guys, you know, raise your hand, five guys are going to jump on you to help you write the other person. You raise your hand, you might get a call back in five days. That's the difference. And I block them out and that's what really makes deals happen because when you look at a startup, the first deals they get are from friends and family, people they know, people they've worked with and that relationship. I'm we're kind of getting off topic, but this is critical, especially for your career, because the people who are making half a million million dollars a year are not not SDRA setting meetings. So there're people do an enterprise deals. Well, son, have you noticed? So? I remember. So I've been I'm a face to face guy, have been my entire career, and I mean I'll use the technology, you know, much like I use it to my advantage. But I've noticed a shift, and maybe it's because of the advent or the increased usage of strs and the increased use of the tech, but now when I talk to somebody on the phone for the first time or better yet, meet a minute networking event or whatever it is, and and I say to them, Oh, you're in Denver, I'm in Denver too. Let's not, let's not get on the phone. I'll why don't I swim by your office? I'll just swim by your office, will spend fifteen minutes talking. They're like you're going to drive all the way across Denver to spend fifteen minutes...

...with me? Yeah, I would. I would prefer to do that then to get on the phone for fifteen minutes. The surprise at first that I'm used to see in like ten years ago. I don't know if I'm ready for that step. Now it's like the surprise like wow, this person actually wants to come spend time with me, and I find that the number of people that say no has gone way down. Like Oh yeah, come on over, let me show you the office, let me you know, let's spend fifteen minutes, which turns into forty five. And there's just that a lot of people. And I don't want to make it an age thing. I don't want to sound ages all I probably am. It's probably it's a millennial thing, like they just don't want to get in the car and go over there or the organization is structured in such a way that they can't. I think it's more that. I think it's because if you're in sale ells and you're not out meeting facetoface with clients, your income is capped, even it just because the deal will not be as big. And I've I've seen it too many times to believe me. No one hates getting on a plane more than me. But when you do and you know go through all that time consuming our Ju is hassle, but when you're sitting down with that client, you know I can get so much more done and tell it exactly. I get a sense for where the deal is and what it's going to take. You cannot get that on the phone. Oh No, there's so much you can't read from. I mean no matter if you're looking at them on camera, and I'm probably could say that maybe only twenty percent of the online meetings I do actually have us all turning on our cameras. But when I'm sitting across or you can read their body language. You can get a sense for what they're experiencing. You can tell by you. Are they looking at you? Are they looking at their phone? You know that there's just so much more information you can collect facetoface. So for me, one of the things that I would kind of bring it try and bring it back, is to say if you're working for an organization that doesn't want you meeting facetoface, that's a flag. For me. It's a flag. It's a big flag for me. That's a first job only. Yeah, and and if you don't get that, that opportunity, and if that, if you're you're okay with that, that's fine, but don't have the expectation because you're capped logistically. It probably like one hundred and fifty a year. Right as an is an in that as a great inside account, exact right on the outside the skies the limit. It's up to your creativity. Look, that actually brings me to my next thing that's like, you know, really territory and complant are so tightly coupled that you know, how often have you been like bait and switched where they're like, oh, that's all, you'll have the whole west coast for three hours? Or that the complant. You know they have a high target income and you know but the base is kind of small, but the variables are so staged that you know you really have to crush it to get that target income. On the question, I think one of the questions I always ask, the first question I ask about a complaint, is is it capped? Forget it. If it's capped, then we don't have...

...anything else to talk about because that's not why I do that's not why I do what I do. So if it's not cath then we can talk. And then the way I think looking at territory and complaint, one of the questions becomes how often in the last twenty four months or even go back three years, have you changed the territories? Have they been realigned like that? I want to know that because that tells me you guys are still trying to figure it out. And then when it comes to the Complan, if it's so overengineered, I don't, I don't. You know. And Look, let's just be realistic. Sales Reps, when you put a COMP plan and I've designed my fair share and watch this happen and I've accepted my fair share and done it myself, it's a game. It becomes a game. So she'll get you. US set the rules and my job is to make as much money as I can finding holes in your plan. Right said and and that's just the reality of it. Now, if it's so overengineered and you've got like this huge committee, let's say it's a SMB, small meeting business, and that the complaints so overengineered and there was like ten people involved in creating it, that's a little bit of a flag. Now I'm not saying don't take the job, it's just really make sure you understand the complant. The ones that I really find the most flexible in this, I think goes back to the manager in the leadership, is like, look, they know what you're doing with the complant, so I can put the complant in front of you and then just be honest and work with them and say, look, I okay, I can work within this Complan, but if I find a situation that isn't covered by the complant, we need to have a conversation. If they're willing to do that, okay, then I'm not so worried. I like the simple complants. Set a target. Don't talk to me about what you think my total target comps should be, because it's going to be bigger than that. If it's not capped, it's definitely going to be bigger than that. So don't. I'm not worried about that. I'm more worried about it's not being overengineered. It's easy to understand and it's not some you know, for Excel spreadsheets that I've got to create in order to calculate what fraction what I'm going to get. When that's a pain in my ass, I don't I don't have time for that. If it's, you know, relatively simple and straightforward and it's not capped, we're good now. Now Batan switch. That's happened twice. I have a tendency. The first time I kind of live with it and you know then that turns into the dark cloud that follows you around. The second time I was like, Whoa, Whoa, I'm out, no way, right, right, jumped it. I can go someplace else and do this. And it kind of actually swings back to the how good of a relationship with you have with the manager, because at the manager can cook a great complant for you, you're golden. But if you, if you, if you get like things like have the territories change within the scope of the complant? If it does, what happens? And how do you realign the the the quota? And okay, so what happens? You know? Is it a sixmonth complant, which is huge red flag to me. You know, it's like, what in wait a minute, what do you have? A daily complant? CUT IT UP.

That's a handicap. You know what that is. It's like, we don't know what we're doing, but we damn sure we don't want to pay you much, you know, and it is a big game because, let's face it, you know, I've been on a board of a couple of companies in the CEO sand bags the board. Okay, the VP of sales sand bags the CEO, and then the regional managers sand bag the VP and the reps sandbag the VP. It trickles down and everyone knows it. Right. So, but everybody's who's smart knows like, okay, the Board's looking for twenty percent growth. We can't go in saying we're going to get ten percent growth. Who can say, Oh, we'll get in fifteen to eighteen, right, and then they say now we okay, we'll settle at nineteen. And then that trickles down. And is the quota really a division of the number reps into the total number rear right? And what's crazy is I had a consultant on my on my BETB podcast. All he does is this and I go well, what is the industry standard expectation of the number of reps that will make quota? He goes sixty percent, and I'm like you remember in the S it was always based off of a hundred percent, right, but today is that today they're expecting only sixty percent. That means they're overassigning quota and I'd say I think that numbers high. I mean just I just think that's high, just from the organizations I've worked with. Sixty percent of refs making quota. I don't know if I mean I'm trying to think if in the last twelve months any of the clients I've worked with had more than, I want to say more than forty, really forty five percent of refs making quota consistently. Because that that that's career crippling. It is without it out because of your hiring manager and or art forces people to lie, which is probably more common. Well, yeah, right, because if only forty percent, say even the fifty percent, just to round it off, that that other fifty percent isn't going to be able to get a job. Plus they're going to be either fired or or, you know, work the way out of the company because are not making their number right, and then they go look for a job. And the hiring manager, I don't want to interview anyone who can't make their number. Then I was talking to a lot of people. That right. So I think we're almost mandating mediocrity today. That's a really good point. I would you know, I hadn't thought about like them. You were. I think you're one hundred percent right. I think we have set up structures that are not only mandating it but allowing it, and that gets into a whole bigger conversation, I'm sure, but I mean when you think about it, the sales job is to move the ball down the field into the red zone and score revenue and grow revenue. That is our job and it's the reason I'd moved from marketing to sales, back before all the tech made marketing, you know, data available. was because it was. It was so simple that you are successful if you hit your...

...quota or exceed it. There's that. We're not there's nothing else to talk about. Like it's that simple. And where's the fun? The Fun isn't it sixty percent of your number? The Fun isn't eighty percent of your number? The Fun is at a hundred and ten. Oh Yeah, one hundred and fifty percent of you. We wearing those accelerators that you know are like cocaine. Yeah, you know you're going to taste me in the front that. I would know what that's like. I don't know either. I've never heard of that. I've never heard of that, but my business partner and I were talking today and she even said she was do you remember the first time you got your seventy fivezero commission check? And I'm like, Oh, yeah, I remember it, and that is what I strive for that I want that again, and it gets it's Padlovian ys, wow, that that off of that one deal in the first quarter of it. I'm getting. Okay, yes, please more and I will work harder. But that's what for me, it's the money's great, but for me it's the game. I love the game. I love the puzzle of it. That's why I love be to be complex sales, because it's a puzzle, like how do I put this thing together? It's a complant, it's a puzzle. How do I beat this game right? And that type of drive and curiosity has to be fostered by the management, supported by the culture. It has to be part of the DNA of the organization and it has to manifest itself in the way that you comp and interact with and hire and coach your sales organizations right. And let's face it, sales draws people who are money motivated and if you don't motivate them with money, you're missing the point because, yeah, you'll get the smiling and nodding, but that doesn't get the people up at four in the morning to head off to the air port, you know, drudge through all of that stuff to, you know, to hang out in the lobby in an unannounced meeting to try and get five minutes with a procurement manager who's, you know, way overworked, as the last person on earth they want to see as you you get your donuts in your hand and begging to get that order through. You know, because I did a video on youtube about sales rep with a god Co complex exact and it was a parody on the movie malice where the there's a Baldwin. I saw then. I saw that. Yes, I watch that. That was great. That's great. I watch. Yeah, when you posted on like then, I saw that. Yeah, in the tagline at the closes. He was on on the road December thirty one, and he doesn't like to be second guest. Oh Yeah, Oh yeah, it's just it's a there's a drive. I don't know, there's you know, I think when people start looking for the next sales jobs, maybe one of the first places that they should look at is themselves. They should do some self assessment, like what, you know, why am I in sales and what is my motivator? The money's great, because then it removes a lot of concerns, right, but at some point you've got to ask yourself, you know, is there an endgame for you? Like for me, I can't ever imagine not being in sales. Even now, as you know, with the value selling stuff that we're doing in the training I'm selling it every day. We're going after big complex deals and working with startups. I get to sell it and then train it...

...and then work with the clients. That's the perfect sweet spot for me because I get all the best parts of the world. But you need to check with yourself. So why are you in sales? Are you willing to make the sacrifices that are necessary to deliver the results to the company and to yourself, to your family, to your friends, whatever it may be? Like? What is driving you to do it so, and what job you pick next or how you evaluated? I think that's probably the place I would recommend most people start. Ask Yourself, why the hell are you in sales, and do you know what that really means? Yeah, because it is a very personal decision and you got to find the right match for you, not for for me or or Chad right, right, like, we'll do okay, on our own. You got it. You got to figure out what's right for you. All right, everyone that does it. For this episode of the B Tob Revenue Executive Experience. Hope you enjoyed listening to Brian and I talked about things you should be thinking about as you contemplate your next move in your sales career. It's a conversation that we enjoyed having. Hope you guys found some value in it. And remember, as you start looking for those organizations, you need to look at not only where you think you're going to have the greatest success, but organizations that can help support your efforts, that you're going to plug into seamlessly really provide value from day one. Make sure that the compensation plan, the leadership things of that nature are set up it in order to make you successful and the company successful as a whole. We appreciate you listening. Please do us a favorite, drop US review on itunes, shoot us an email with suggestions for other individuals you'd like us to have on the show, where other topics you'd like us to cover, and until next time, we have value prime solutions with you all, nothing but the greatest success. You've been listening to the B Tob Revenue Executive Experience. To ensure that you never miss an episode, subscribe to the show in Itunes for your favorite podcast player. Thank you so much for listening. Until next time,.

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