The B2B Revenue Executive Experience
The B2B Revenue Executive Experience

Episode · 3 years ago

5 Ways to Get Faster Sales by Slowing Down w/ Brandon Bruce

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

Did you know that sometimes the fastest way to get sales is to slow down?

I had a great episode with Brandon Bruce, co-founder and CEO of Cirrus Insight, a customer relationship management application, who shows you how to achieve sales success with the “Art of the Slow Sale.”

In our far-ranging discussion, he outlined some of his thoughts about how slowing down your sales process actually speeds up your closing rates.

Let's be thoughtful and methodical about what we're doing. Let's not constantly just be hustling around in some frenetic state, because at the end of the day, that starts to freak out the customer right because they feel like they're being pushed. You were listening to the BDB revenue executive experience, a podcast dedicated to helping executives train their sales and marketing teams to optimize growth. Whether you're looking for techniques and strategies were tools and resources, you've come to the right place. Let's accelerate your growth in three, two, one. Welcome everyone to the B Tob Revenue Executive Experience. I'm your host, Chad Sanderson. Today we're talking about the slow sale, getting permission from your prospects, applying smart effort, bold action and patient waiting. Sounds like a craft cocktail for be tob sales, no doubt, but we're going to go deep to tackle the topic. We have with US Brandon Bruce, Co founder and COO of serious insight. Brandon, thanks for taking time to be on the show today. Yeah, thanks, chat thanks for having me on. So, before we jump in, we always like to ask one random, odd question to give our guests a little bit more insight into you and just randomly picked this one last night. Actually nothing behind it, but is there one person in your life that you've met where you were kind of you found us, of kind of in all of them when you met them, and kind of what was that interaction like and would you take away from it any interestingly, one of the people that I felt that way about is a basketball player here. I live in Knoxville, Tennessee, so basketball is pretty huge here and I would say we've got a top five team on the men's side this year and for the past several years. But the women's basketball team is especially famous. So pats on it was a coach here for many, many years. When she retired was the winningest coach, both number of wins, a thousand and ninety eight wins and eight NCAA championships. So pretty phenomenal. Unfortunate I didn't have a chance to meet her, but I did get to meet one of our star players, Tom Coo holds cloth, who played at Tennessee and went on to play in the pros, and I got to see her last year speak...

...live and Knox and kind of a small audience and yeah, I just thought she was awesome. So that was one of that was one of the more recent experiences. Rose like this is. This is someone that is super cool, excellent, excellent. All right, so far our listeners give us a little more context around serious insight in your role there. Yeah, so Ryan Hass my cofounder, and I started serious insight seven years ago. We were the first application that connected Gmail with sales force. So sales forcecom the big customer Relationship Management Platform, and so Ryan identify that there was a gap between those platforms. A lot of businesses were starting to move to Gmail or just starting off on Gmail. Whereas before it was, you know, really a consumer platform, it became a business platform for email and calendar, and so serious insight is our effort to integrate that with sales for so we put this nice side panel inside Gmail where you can manage your customers without ever leaving inbox. So it's a big time Saber for those of us that work in sales. Yeah, I'd fend anybody out there who isn't where. I have a confession I have. I was using your stuff, man, seven years. I'm getting old, so maybe I'm trying to find like. You see that and I'm like, I could have swore we were in, we were using it within, like really close to launch, because that was a big gap. I mean it's in today. It's still not even it's a completely resolved in any elegant manner. Well, well, I owe you a thank you then, because I anytime I'm talking with people about I will how did you launch? You know what I got you that point, and it was the feedback of those early users. We had about thousand users in the pilot and then we had our early customer base and those were the folks that were not only pushing us and also cheerleading, but also helped to figure out what should the product do, how should it work, what a sales workflow look like across all these different industries, different sizes of companies, different geographies, and so yeah, it was really a voice of the customer story where feedback, you know, from you and your team and thousands of other teams around the world helped make the make the product what it is. Yeah, it was. It was. I remember. We've I've rolled it out at least two...

...places. I know that before I started doing sales and ebling stuff when I was running sales organizations and we had, you know, sales for says, the you know system of record, our main three hundred sixty review of the customer. It was always all right, if we're going to get sales force, we can't just get sales force. We're also going to have to add serious to it, because we need we're using Gmail and we need that linkage. Yeah, you don't want sales force to be empty right at the classic garbage in, garbage out platform. If you don't put anything in there, it's just empty. Yeah, and so most of our customer communications, especially then, but even so today, are in the Inbox, in the calendar, right, even this podcast, right, we scheduled by email and by calendar, right, one where we live. Think that information into the system of record so that it's truly a system of record, has value for a lot of teams. Yeah, without a doubt. All right, so let's start with a definition. We weren't talk about the slow sale. Now this is going to blow some minds. Like we're always here in sales reps. are always told move faster, faster, faster. Right, and one of the things I have liked about you know, some of the materials that you guys provided in advance of this and our emails back and forth was the power in patients, and I'll be the first admit this is probably what my therapist would have me work on the most. But let's talk about a definition of what you mean when you say the slow sale so the audience understands what we're talking about. Yeah, I mean, and in fairness, I think most of us that are attracted to sales as a profession, as an industry, right, I means here, since I we sell sales software to sales people a hundred percent of the time. It attracts those of us that patients. Is Not like in our top ten list of associate. You associate other verbs, other adjectives with the salespeople, right, like hustle, you know, and in hard work and perseverance into a deal and not accepting no f Nancer and all that good stuff. But the slow sale is really kind of an effort to say, let's hit the pause button, let's be thoughtful and methodical about up what we're doing. Let's not constantly just be hustling around in some frenetic state, because at the end of the day that starts to freak out the customer right because they feel like they're being pushed. So if we back...

...away from the whole celler and buyer relationship and think of ourselves instead of the seller as the buyer, what do we like as part of a sales process, we start to realize that, oh, we also go into the tank for two weeks before we make a substantial purchase. We also don't answer emails and voicemails sometimes, and this shouldn't be a big thing that freaks out the seller. This is simply the pace. This is the normal pace of a customer and seller relationship. And so the slow sale is kind of an an effort in written formed to unpack that and say, like the old and another basketball reference, I'm six eight, so I played the fair amount of Bask my day. You know, John Wooden, who coached the UCLA team, used to say be quick but don't hurry, and so the slow sale is like that. It's by no means saying hey, let's all just slow down and take a long vacation and sales will just come to us. I don't think it works, not for most of us. If you work for a company and that's how it works, that's awesome. For you. But so it's not saying, Hey, let's just be really slow, like customer contacts you, just give it a couple days before you contact him back. Absolutely not like you want to be Johnny on the spot and those situations. But what it's simultaneously saying is let's not push people around, let's not try to advance a deal faster than it's meant to go because because it's just not going to happen and in fact you'll chase the way a deal that otherwise might have come your way if you're trying to push it, which all of us kind of understand, but we're not patient enough to really act on it most of the time. Yeah, I mean that's self awareness right. Is is a challenge, I mean, especially once we're, you know, we're pushing sales refs to get hit certain numbers and do it in certain amounts of time. You know, there's there's a normal level of anxiety, I think that comes in sales that makes that difficult. But I'd agree with you those that aren't, those that are aware that their efforts and the way they approach a customer actually resonate with that customer. They change the change the hum so to speak. Right they over the top. They're going to pick up on that absolutely...

...and it's kind of just a getting back to basics. This is nothing new, this is nothing all of us don't sort of intrinsically no. But I was talking to a group last week and just saying like the importance of saying please and thank you, the importance of showing up on time, the importance of doing what you say you're going to do right. These are like basic threshold level principles for getting through kindergarten all the way from having a great career. And it's the same with with this concept of slowing down. So, even though I kind of learned this selling for syris inside, I'd like three pending, you know, what we would now call mid market deals. I was really excited about because they were going to be huge deals for us. It was in the first year of starting the company and I was nervous because I was going to take a long weekend with my family and I had not been away from the business at all, right, like twenty four seven, not been away from it at all. Should I wasn't going to be following up with those customers doing that three day stretch and that freaked me out because I was impatient. I want to get the deals and it was going to mean a lot for the company and but I had payer out. I felt like I'd given them a good demo. I think I thought they wanted the product. We Didn Go. She had a contract, nothing had been signed, and so normally I would follow up like hey, you have a chance to review the contract. You think we can get this done today, etc. Etc. And instead of doing that, all the deals just sat and then, Lo and behold, I came back from that trip and all three deals came our way. So I'm very thankful for but it also was this time for reflection and being like, wait a second. All of them worked out and I didn't hammer any of them over the head. So I sort of learned that lesson a little bit for myself. And yet once we started hiring salespeople, as the manager, I was the person going like hey, how is that demo? When do you think that's going to close? Can we get closed in the bathrooms? It's like I knew that wasn't the right thing to do. And yet, to your point, you're still watching the numbers, you're still trying to close every month, every quarter, every year, as high as you can. So it's a good lesson for all of us to learn and relearn, not only if we're selling on our own account, but also as we managed teams, not to push them into a state...

...of anxiety beyond that which is normal. Yeah, and there's there's this concept when we when we talk to customers, were plans as this concept we use a respectful persistence, and so it's that reminding yourself, being aware, like you don't want to freak them out and you're not going to move them any faster than they're willing to move themselves. So if there's not a compelling event or something, all you're doing is being you know, I compare it to have a little nephew who is adorable. I might going to put that out there, but also at that age was like hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, and it's like you don't want to do that because I can tell you, is adorable as this nephew is, you still want to put them in a different room and lock the door, right. So you don't want to do that to your customers. Yeah, when I was doing before we started serious, I was doing fundraising for a college, and so actually used to make a list of lists of what I called non weird excuses to reach out. Like a weird excuse is, hey, we're doing a fundraising campaign and we'd like you to give to it, like it's just a little bit. It's it's too much. And so none weird excuse would be, you know, I'm traveling to Philadelphia, you live in Philadelphia. Take your dinner, like that's less weird. It's like geographically relevant. Let's do this. You know. Weird one is like, Hey, you graduate in fifty seven, you should get fifty seven dollars. It's like this, so arbitrates. It's so strange. So I tried to come up with non weird reasons to reach out to people, and that's the same, I think, in any industry. So that you know today we look at it and we go what's a good reason to follow up with a prospect beyond just annoying them like hey, are you going to find the deal? Like, I know you're a salesperson, I know you want me to sign it, I know you're waiting for me to sign it. That's not an interesting follow up. You know, an interesting follow up that has worked really well on our side, or regardless of the point at which you're in the deal, is if you don't have it already, to request and share cell phone numbers with the buyer. That's been very,...

...very successful for us and I think a lot of other companies too. It's it's a non weird thing to ask for. It's like, Oh, we'd like to create a relationship between me and you. Are Company, your company. We want to be able to be in touch and quickly, and so you know, maybe emails not going to be fast enough. Like what if you need to reach me when you're in a meeting and you have a question about our product? You just want to hit me up right away? Text message is where it cut through all the clatter. Right. So open rates on text messages are pretty in close to a hundred percent. But you have to have a relationship. What you really like not going to share with everybody. So if you if you're if the prospect is willing to share the cell phone number with you. Your deals trending. I think generally speaking it's heading in the right direction, and so that can be a good way also to follow up, even if you have paper out there that you're waiting to get signed like hey, by the way, can I get your cell phone number just so we can, you know, be in touch with each other, because this looks like it's going to close pretty soon. I want to make sure on boarding is really smooth, the handoff is good, and so let's Gel and if they're like no, it's like that, maybe this isn't moving forward as well as I'm like, if they're like Oh, yeah, of course, and what's yours? Okay, great, let's, you know, put each other on our contact list, that's a pretty good sign. Excellent. So another element, as we were prepping for this, that we talked about was the concept of expanding the industry category you're in rather than creating a new one. So, you know, companies all the time have to decide where am I going to go, if I'm going to continue the growth, to I stay where I am? Do we introduce new products into the existing market or new solutions into new markets or things like that? And and you were pretty, you know, clear that you felt like there was a way to make sure that where you are, the industry you're in, expanding that category was was kind of the direction you might suggest. People go help me unpack that a little bit. Yeah, I mean, and to be fair, I think you can win both ways. So I don't think it's a zero sum game where it's like you right, we join a category or Sus start a category. All of us had examples of ones that have worked up plays for us. When we launched, it was very clear. Just like if you're in APP the installs on the iphone or an APP installs on an android device, you launch inside the itunes APP store or the Google play...

...store. For us, we launched inside the sales force ecosystem. Right. So we were for many years the top reviewed APP on the sales force APP exchange. That's where a lot of our top leads came from, and so being able to launch inside that established cohort of customers, right, thousands of customers around the world, was really helpful because it allowed us to get to market very fast after launch. Like we launched. We were to market, we got to the top of the APPIC change. We stay there for six months. It was a self fulfilling prophecy of you know, the more leaves that sauce, the more than installed. But, like the product, wrote a positive review. Other people see the review great social proof they would install, and so we had this really nice fly wheel effect going, which is great. At the same time we've also seen companies very successfully launch and kind of focus on creating a socalled category. So when we launched seven years ago, I think it's pretty fair to say there weren't a lot of people talking about sales enablement. It's not really a phrase that I remember hearing back now. Now wasn't, how in the leasticon right even sales acceleration. If you would have said that seven years would have been like what huh? There was more, you know, customer relationship management, sales force automation was still more of a phrase which goes back, you know, fifteen, twenty years. But you don't hear as many people today talking about Oh yeah, SSA. It's more like no, no, sales enablement, and you start to see more job titles now that are sales enablement, sales operations, sales effectiveness. Those are all pretty new job titles. I think if you go back ten years, there's not that many people that have those titles that describe what they do for work. So for companies that have successfully said Hey, we are the sales enabling platform where we we equal sales acceleration. That can take years of branding and sometimes it's a big budget to go out and do that kind of, you know, advertising and get people to start spreading this as a phrase. But if you can then own it, it becomes very valuable. I think it's an exercise and require some patients and also requires a big effort...

...to kind of define a category. So we benefited as a bootstrap start up from kind of joining existing categories like Oh you, sales force in genail these two huge cloud pot forms. We're going to be the little cloud platform that's it's the middle and make them more valuable together, makes them actually work. I can say that I understand why you wouldn't want you, but it really I mean for those who haven't looked at the solution, and I'll be read u front, there's no I got an email from Brandon's people saying hey, brandon should be a guest. There's he's not paying me to say this and anybody who's listened long enough knows I'm pretty clear with kind of my opinions on stuff. It does amplify the value of both of those platforms because it doesn't get in the way of what sales reps are normally doing and tools that can do that, that can provide value and amplification without requiring reps to do additional, you know, overhead. Those are golden. So if you haven't, guys, if you haven't looked at this solution, highly recommend that you do so. One more question I want to ask, and again I got your you know, I got your bio from your people and I'm doing the air quotes and one of the things that I noticed in the bio that really caught me, even though we decided to focus kind of on slow sale and you know, how do you expand an existing category? There's a bullet in your biolus is navigating the post predictable revenue world. Anybody who's in sales or business has read predictable revenue. I would love to know what kind of what's behind that. Yeah, I think you predictable revenue one of the early books that Ryan, my cofound, and I am both read and we're like this makes sense right the we're building a sales machine, so we want to know if, given x input, the quote unquote top of the funnel, then here's how they progress. Two stages and they come out at the bottom and I think it's a it's a great book to read. If you haven't read the book yet, Aaron Ross wrote it. He was instrumental in building out the sales development team at sales force, which were part of the ecosystem. So it all makes sense. He included serious insight and one of the early books...

...that he wrote, which was awesome. But also, as I started to look at how our company worked, some of the most exciting times on our company timeline were not explained by the predictable aspect of our revenue model. It was do outliers. Right. What's the thing that really jumped revenue at a given month? It was this enterprise customer that came to us through a very non traditional channel. It was a decision we made to invest early on customer success and expansion, and so that didn't fit into the traditional, you know, prospect to you know, sales, lead to this, to that, to the next finally to the close. And so anyway, it just started getting more thought to yes, we want to build an engine, because otherwise it's like well, we'll just see what happens next month, and that's not really good enough to take to the CEO or to the board, like last month was good, month before was not so good. Who knows? It's a cool happened next, like that's exciting, but it's not. There's a lot more anxiety wrapped up in that. At the same time, I think it's being open to you know, if everything was purely predictable, it would be a lot easier to start and run a company than all of us know that it actually is. Right, would be a lot easier to be a salesperson. It was just like hey, cool, I'm a widget maker, right, I'm in an assembly line. Stuff comes to me half finished and I finish it. Most of us are in a position where the no, that's not how my business works, that's not how my job works. Like I have to be creative. I have to think out of the box of non weird excuses to reach out to my customers. I have to use not just email and phone, and linked in at that are I also need to visit my prospects. Right, need to send them personalized and gifts, because that's what cuts through in my industry. And so it's being open to the creativity that most of us need to employ, whether as individual sales people or sales managers or companies. It's not predictable, but we start making these little breakthroughs of this works for us and so we're going to double down on it.

And those nine other things that we tried last month don't work, and so we're done with those, at least for now. Maybe we'll try them again in six months or a year. Yeah, and it's such a it's I love that point about creativity, right, because, especially today, be to be enterprise sales reps, even marketing people. It's such a noisy environment, right. There's so many people reaching out, there's so much content being produced. Do you need to be creative to get around that? But you have to do it on a firm foundation, right, something that allows you to do that, you know, build a machine and keep it going, but also be able to, you know, occasionally push it into the red line, push that engine into the red line and see what happens. I think it's a I think it's a delicate balance for a lot of individuals and especially for enterprise sales teams. I see that be a huge challenge, but I do understand the power of that awareness. Yeah, and I think it's also just kind of a small effort to say if you haven't built out this perfect machine that just, you know, hums right along. It's a sterling engine, right, hardly an inputs and it just creates energy forever. If you haven't built that, awesome, because ninety nine point nine percent of everybody else hasn't built it either. Right. There's only a few companies where you look at and you go, Oh wow, they're like really looks like they're printing money, right, thinking of stuff like like Google with ad words, right. I mean it's just like it's incredible. That's a machine like beautiful thing. And there's other companies like that. It's not just them, but for many of us there's a lot of hacking to do between where we are today and where we want to be right year from now, five years from now, ten years from now, and and the process itself, the journey, is going to be exciting. That's not necessarily going to be pretty. There's gonna be a lot of mistakes made, there's going to be a lot of just hustling, there's gonna be a lot of being in the weeds, and I think that's okay. And so there's a danger of this concept of predictable revenue is. See how easy it is. Just draw a picture of a funnel on the whiteboard and you put stuff in the top and stuff comes out the bottom. Like, how hard can this be? It's a useful mental model, but I think it also oversimplifies what it is that that many...

...of us do for a living. Excellent. Yeah, I agree. I agree. All right, so let's change the direction here a little bit. We ask all of our guests kind of two standard questions towards into each interview. First is simply, as a revenue executive yourself, that makes you a prospect for other sales professionals. Right. We kind of touch on this a little bit. But HOLP, our audience understand if somebody doesn't have a relationship with you, if there's not a referral in but they believe they have something that you know, you should, you could benefit from. What's the most effective way for them to build credibility, capture your attention and secure, you know, ten, fifteen, twenty minutes on your calendar? Yeah, I try to pay attention to those things. Like if I try to be self conscious enough, the one I open an email, I go I pause, I know, why did I just open that email. What about the subject line got me? What about the time of day that they sent it? is they're saying about their name? That was interesting that I recognize it. Do I know their a friend or family member? So, especially when it comes from someone I don't know, like what got me to open the email in the first place or to pick up the phone or which is highly unlikely, so that doesn't happen that often, or to look at the visual voice mail is more like it. And the side. This is what I'm actually going to listen to and possibly call back, and a few of the themes that I realized, you know, one is if it's particularly relevant, and some of it's almost like nostalgic. So if people reach out and they're like, Hey, you know, you went to u see Sainta Barbara. I'm a fellow Gaucho. You know, I graduated in this year. When did you finish? You know, I was there when Soandso was the star of the team. Anyway, you know, I moved away, so I'm not next to that awesome, awesome beach anymore. I'm selling this now. I see you're running a software company, but I might be relevant and somehow that sort of connection to the past. It was like okay, cool, like I want to you know, want to do a solid for my other fellow alum from Ledge or high school or the person from the community where I grew up. Like there's a lot of that stuff and then there's also present stuff, and some of this is related, you know, probably the fact that...

...you know we're in Knoxville, Tennessee there there's an increasing number, but not a ton of like software companies. Right we're not in the in the hype zone of Silicon Valley and Austin and Boston, New York, etc. which are all awesome cities, but we're kind of outside of the bubble. So if people say like Hey, I'm going to be in your area, like I'm going to be in Knoxville, I love to swing by, like looks like you guys are killing at that's unique. You know, I'd love to swinging by grab blunch, bring coffee in the office and I'm bring downuts for the team or something like that. Like that cuts through the clutter because that's a different because not that many people stop by right as if they say I'll be in your area, but they're referring to our other location, which is in Urvine, California. That's not as unique. It's like, yeah, lots of people stop by in R vine. Like the day not as many stopped by our office. So if they're willing to make trip out here or if they're making a trip anyway, it's just sort of relevant. Right, I'm going to be a Knoxville next Monday. Do you have any time free? I'll look at the counter and be like sure, like you want to take the trouble to swing by the office and say hey, like it calls upon our better nature to like I want to be a good host. I want to show them that this is a great city for building a company. I want to know to reflect well on the team. I want them to meet the team and we can say look at our talented team. So those are two ways that I've noticed that not only do I open the email, but I'll respond to it, and typically fairly favorably, like yes, stop by or sure, I'll take a call to see what you have on offer because we share something in common. It's not a hundred percent chance, like sometimes it's like hey, I also went to your college, and then the email gets weird. I think template territory where it's like now, I you definitely did not write this yourself. Right, then the response rate goes way down. Similarly, the the artificially personalized emails usually go south. Right. I'm thinking of ones even where you can tell it was sort of written by quote unquote, Ai, like hi, Brandon, I see you live in Tennessee. I've you ever been to the Tennessee theater? It's like who actually,...

...what real human being would actually ask that question, like it's just a weird question, like who of us would think to ask that? It was clearly written by a machine that just said what's a local attraction that people like to go to? How about the Tennessee theater? Right? How about in the stadium right where the UT balls play? So those things just sort of like, you know, our hair goes up a little bit and we say now, I don't think I want to engage here. This is a little too sketchy. At the other ways somehow breakthrough. All right, perfect, all right. Last question. We call our acceleration insight. There's one thing you could tell sales, marketing or services people, one piece of advice that, if they listened, you believe would help them hit their targets or see them. What would it be and why now? The one thing that's made the biggest difference for us every year for last seven years is being very generous with our time. Easier said than done. Right. Sometimes, when you get really busy, is sort of like well, which calls shrid prioritize. Not Sure I want to make time for that prospect. You. How big of a deal could this be? But we've had the most success when we've been very open to essentially talking with anybody at any time about anything, and so sometimes that's a call where you realize this person isn't even really going to be a buyer, like they just had a question about the industry. Okay, like yeah, there's going to be a few of those, so that you're going to have a few half an hour time slots where you feel like I definitely could have spend that time better. Right, I feel like I could have put that to you somewhere else. But the net net is by being generous with time. Most prospects don't want to waste our time, just like we don't want to waste theirs. So the net and net is by being very available and just saying sure, grab time on my accolendar. You pick it and I'll meet you there. And yes, if you're an overseas customer and you want to do a demo at two in the morning, okay, like, I can't do it all the time, but sure, once twice a week, like will stay up late and give demos an Australia. That's been really useful and that's helped. Also our repute is become new, because it's like, well, yeah, we want to do a demo,...

...you know, with three different companies, but the other two weren't really available during our time slot. But you guys showed up at two in the morning. You know, this seems like good company and do business with thank you. We're doing that. Like you really went out of your way. So now all of a sudden, in the you know, the given get theory of sales. Right, you've given something and it looks like a pretty generous gift. It's the gift of time. So make your calendar available that customers book on it, answer all their questions, talk to them and then, increasingly now, we've noticed, meet with them in person. Right, what's old is new again. Right, we do most of ourselves remotely. Probably a lot of us do. We do all my demos all time, but to the extent that it's possible, you know, if the deals the right size, then hey, it's great to meet you. Hey, I'm I was going to pop over to Kansas City. I can fly out next week. Is there a day next week that we can meet? I'll meet the whole sales team. Really, you would come all the way? So so you know, Kansas City to meet our team? Yeah, totally, we do this all the time. I'd love to spend time doing that. You know, you signing thing. We're just going to come show you because I think you're going to love what we have. And again, that's putting yourself out there. It's saying I we're we're confident enough, we have enough resources, will meet you where you are and we'll make it worth your while. So yeah, that's the number the number one thing, the as generous as possible. I think that's a great point. I mean, I'm a big believer in Can Business Karma. We I always used to tell my team's if that phone rings, if somebody calls in, pick it up because, you know, even if they are outside of kind of our target persona or target you know company size for this campaign, for this quarter. Talk to him because you don't know where they're going to go. You don't know what other opportunities might come out as a result that conversation. We're what, quite frankly, we might learn as a result. So I think there's a great deal of value in being really aware, of being a little bit more accepting of spending time with people, even if your initial reaction is and I'm not sure it's going to be a deal. There's also that you know factor of well, we don't know where it could go, right. That's the unpredictable part of it. A great example that we've seen several times over the life of...

...our company would be someone that comes in and this was sure like they're they're a lone wolf right, like I'm just looking for myself. It's like, okay, it's one seat, like every seat counts, but for an enterprise sales person it's like that doesn't look super interesting, right. I mean you're talking about a few hundred bucks a year. But we what we've seen several times is that Lone Wolf is a consultant that represents a company. They're doing their betting for a company with thousands of seats, right. So making them very happy. They're almost like a secret shopper, and making them very happy, amazing them with what's available and all these resources, and we're great at training and staff, and they go, okay, this is a great experience and I can see that you can scale it. Let me now talk about why I'm trying this off, where I'm doing it on the half of big co over here that's ready to load up, and it's like, Oh, I'm so glad that we spent time with this person and we, you know, we treated them like, you know, like a customer should be treated, which is, we don't care about this size, we just want you to have an awesome experience. And then they say, go, I had an awesome experience. I'll translate that to my client. Right. Oh, now we're talking. That's interesting. And they don't. They don't come with that. Hello, I represent a five tho customer. No, they want to see who you are for real, right, sort of the classic integrity thing, like what are you doing? Someone's not looking. They want want to see that part of the company so that they know that their client is going to be in good hands. Right, right, excellent, all right. Brandon, can't thank you enough for taking time to be on the show. It has been great having you. If somebody wants to get in touch with you learn more about serious or the slow sale or getting past predictable revenue, what's the best way to reach out? Obviously, we were an email company, right. We connect the INBOX, the sifs for so feel free to shoot me an email, brandon at serious insightcom or, like I just said, better yet, come to Knockville, Tennessee, and we will host you at the company and join us for a Friday lunch. We love having visitors and yeah, we'll take you out from barbecue accellent. I can't thank you enough for being on the show. Thanks you. I appreciate you having me on. All right, everybody that does of this episode, check us out of Bob Rev exactcom show, the episode of friends, families, Co...

...workers, you know the drill. Until next time, we have value selling associates with you all nothing but the greatest success. You've been listening to the BB revenue executive experience. To ensure that you never miss an episode, subscribe to the show and Itunes or your favorite podcast player. Thank you so much for listening until next time.

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